9. Only Tim Will Tell

Victor and Olivia got married! The Dream Team reminisces on wedding week shenanigans. A listener (a friend) sends in a…...

Victor and Olivia got married! The Dream Team reminisces on wedding week shenanigans. A listener (a friend) sends in a dream featuring Olivia, Victor, and Abraham Lincoln… but like, demonic, as well as some original drawings of the characters in his dream. You can check those out on instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thejungandtherestlesspod/

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59:00 Intro

22:49 Listener Dream

About Dream Bible:

Dream Bible is a free online A to Z dream dictionary dedicated to helping people understand the meaning of their dreams. Unlike other dream interpretation websites or books we extensively research dream symbols by interviewing people about the events occurring in their lives at the time of their dreams.  Inspired by the work of Gillian Holloway Ph.D, we are using a database of over 350,000 dream reports to create the world's most practical dream dictionary based on the waking life experiences of regular people.


Dream Bible entries used in this episode:

Abe Lincoln: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=abraham+lincoln

Fangs: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=fangs

Demons: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=demon

Pictures: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=Pictures

White Trash: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=White+Trash

Cabin: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=cabin

Snow: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=snow

Follow us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thejungandtherestlesspod/

Check out our website for episode transcripts: https://thejungandtherestlesspodcast.com/

Episode Transcript

9. Only Tim Will Tell

[00:00:00] Zach: Hey, sweet dreamers, it, your boy, Zach, from The Jung and the Restless. I just wanted to let you know that as a new podcast, we're still in that phase where Apple Podcast reviews have a, a weirdly disproportionately high impact on our success. So it would really mean the world to us. If you would, you know, give us five stars over there and if you leave a dream in the review, we'll give you a shout out and take a stab at interpreting it on the show.

I mean, even if you hate us, we'll read your hate mail on air if you leave it in the body of a five star review and we'll still love you, man. Anyway, on with the show,

[00:00:49] Olivia: Welcome to The Jung and the Restless. I'm Olivia.

[00:00:53] Victor: I'm Victor. 

[00:01:02] Zach: And I'm Zach. And this is the podcast. That's it. It's the only one.

Intro Music

Now we can say podcast stuff. 

[00:01:40] Olivia: Podcast stuff. This podcast is brought to you by podcast stuff, stuff for your 

[00:01:46] Zach: podcast. I had a, I don't even know if it was a dream, a dream thing or not. But the other day, so I ran outta dental floss and I've been just stealing my roommates and I keep, every night when I floss my teeth, I'm like, I need to buy him more dental floss as well as myself.

And I just keep forgetting. And the other night I had a dream that I went to the store and bought him more tonsil floss. And then the next day I was at the grocery store and I, it actually occurred to me to buy dental floss. 

[00:02:18] Olivia: Oh, your dream self helped 

[00:02:20] Zach: you out. Maybe could be a chicken and the egg thing though, where I, I had the dream because I was thinking about it.

[00:02:26] Olivia: See, I feel like what would've happened to me is I would've had a dream about buying dental floss at the grocery store and then I would've gone to the grocery store and thought that I had already bought the dental 

[00:02:35] Zach: floss. Yeah. Yeah. All lost in the sauce. Lost in the floss. I feel like we talked about at, at our production meeting.

About, about your wedding. Oh yeah. That 

[00:02:48] Olivia: was, we got married. Yeah, that is, that is, um, something that happened between right now and the last time our listeners hurt us, but actually not really. That isn't actually when it happened, 

[00:03:01] Zach: is it? Well, don't break the fourth wall, but yeah, we, we've been talking about it.

It's been like, it's part of the podcast, um, Canon now, so I feel like we have to like rehash our conversation. How was the honeymoon? How was 

[00:03:16] Olivia: the honeymoon in honey? 

[00:03:18] Victor: Uh, it wa it was great. It was really great. Um, nor North, Northern Californias more goth than we expected. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

[00:03:30] Olivia: There's were Ravens 

[00:03:31] Victor: everywhere.

Love Ravens. And then we ended up in like a pumpkin town. 

[00:03:35] Olivia: Oh yeah. That was cool. Yeah. Nice. This town, like, okay. The first place we ended up was like a town of 700 people. And that was very cool and we loved it. And then we ended up in a place that was kind of more residential, but I guess this town's whole thing is that come September, everything is fall.

Like they were su super into pumpkins, super into corn, mazes and all of that, which was kind of fun. Cuz I feel like that preoc October season around here is not really all that October, not a October enough for me anyway. In 

[00:04:11] Zach: Seattle. Mm-hmm. . Oh. Cause coming from, I moved to Seattle from Colorado and I thought of it as like super aal, but, 

[00:04:20] Olivia: well, it is, but I feel like September people are still clinging onto summer around here because we don't, we don't get ready for, you don't get a whole of it

Yeah. Yeah. But, but I personally, I am ready for fall by, um, August . 

[00:04:38] Zach: So is this pumpkin town like, uh, north of the Bay Area? Um, 

[00:04:42] Olivia: south. South, 

[00:04:43] Victor: yeah. Oh, okay. It was really nice. I, I hadn't taken time off work for a long time, and so it was like, it was our first trip together. Really? Mm-hmm. . Yeah. Yeah. A good time.

We all go back there and then see other 

[00:04:53] Olivia: places. Yeah. It was the first time we like, got on a plane and like, properly went somewhere together. Right. Which I, I guess they say you should do that. Um, but, you know, it's, that's supposed 

[00:05:03] Zach: to be a, uh, a big test or something. Test. Yeah. Well, I'm glad it went 

[00:05:09] Victor: well.

How, how'd we do ? It went fine. We, we ran into like all of you would get kind of stressed out if we didn't have a plan figured out. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. and I, my default is very like, go with the flow, like, yeah, we'll figure it out. That's not worth wor like, and so I had to kind of be more, uh, I had to, I had to step up to like making more of a plan so that she could relax a little bit.

[00:05:34] Olivia: Well, cuz I would get really worried about like, I wouldn't wanna go to a rest, just like any restaurant for lunch and, um, miss our chance to like go to a really good restaurant for lunch. And so I was like obsessed with finding the right places to go. And maybe that is, um, maybe that's no way to live, but we ate a lot of really good food, 

[00:05:57] Victor: our personalities a little bit.

Yeah, that's true. At home. At home. Like I am the like structured analytical, like we need to plan and we need to have like a system kind of person. And she's much more go with the flow. And when we were on vacation I was like, yeah, we're just here to relax, have a good time. And she was like, no, we need to optimize the fun that we have.

every day is precious. We need to maximize our utility for this vacation. And yeah. That's so funny. 

[00:06:24] Zach: Yeah. I guess that's why they say you need to travel together. Because you don't know how it's gonna flip, you know? Right. 

[00:06:31] Olivia: Yeah. Well that's the thing is like, I think that dynamic for us actually works well in our day-to-day lives.

So like reversing those roles doesn't not work, it's just we gotta do the other thing. Right. ? Yeah. 

[00:06:44] Zach: Yeah. Yeah. The other one, Audrey has the tools to give to the other one. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. That's . I, I have one experience traveling with an ex where, where I learned firsthand why they say you should do that.

Luckily we were not married. Hmm. Um, cuz that, that, granted we traveled internationally, we went to Paris and the dynamic was really weird cuz she was born and raised in Paris and I, I had never left Disco Continent. Mm-hmm. . So I was like very much a tourist and she was just kind of, I don't wanna see the Eiffel Tower.

I grew up near the Eiffel Tower. I don't wanna look at it. Right. Again, like, I wanna hang out with my friends who only speak French. Oh. Um, so that was a nail. I mean, the whole trip was like a nail in the coffin, but there were probably signs between buying the ticket and taking the trip that it wasn't gonna go well.

[00:07:36] Olivia: Sometimes you just need to see it, like, really have it thrown in your face. Yeah. 

[00:07:42] Zach: Yeah. Especially when you're 22. This happened 10 years ago. 

[00:07:46] Olivia: Mm. Mm-hmm. . But yeah. Um, so yeah, back to, uh, regular life. Nothing's really different. The wedding was really fun. It was really fun. Was to have, yeah. And Zach was there.

I had a blast. That was really cool. Yeah. It was like a whole week of celebration. Mm-hmm. and, um, Yeah. Honestly, I loved the, I loved the rehearsal dinner and the, just bottomless wine that was, yeah, that was a problem. Really. Highlight . , I think in Zach got a little 

[00:08:15] Zach: toasty, I think in the last, was it, it was either the last episode or the episode before that where I had a dream about drinking.

[00:08:24] Olivia: Oh yeah. When I was, that was the last 

[00:08:26] Zach: episode, , and I was saying, uh, you know, I'll probably drink at your wedding. I did a lot all week. So did we, but Well, yeah, . Um, yeah, that first night, the batch party, uh, you Oh, you were pretty Oh yeah. Pretty. Yeah. You're having a good say. Pretty loose. 

[00:08:50] Olivia: That was a very fun night.

The next day was not very fun, but actually I was still hungover. The day after, the day after the batch party, um, which has not happened to me before. I didn't love that 

[00:09:06] Zach: mul, multi-day hangovers. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. I don't know if those are anybody's favorite thing. 

[00:09:11] Olivia: Nah, nah. But that, that night was, that night was pretty fun.

The whole week was fun. It was a good week. It was great. 

[00:09:18] Victor: Yeah. Did a lot more drinking than we were used to though. I was like, my, my, I guess I was drinking so much that like my hands swelled up. It was like my, my ring really went from fitting just perfectly to like, oh, I don't know if I can get this off my finger.

[00:09:32] Olivia: we got his ring resized like two weeks before the wedding, and then I was putting it on him during the ceremony and I was like, oh my God. Like, is this gonna fit? I, it got, we got it there, but , 

[00:09:44] Zach: yeah, it's very, that's very temporary. The blue booze boat. Booze bloat. That's harder to say than I thought it would be.

The blues boat, I do that all the time where I have like one weekend where I'm just cutting loose. Kind of with everything and I'll pin it on food cuz that makes sense. And then I go like clean and it only takes like 24 hours to 48 hours of no beer before I'm like, oh, that was all just water weight. Mm.

Mm-hmm. or whatever BLO is, 

[00:10:13] Victor: you're like inflamed from poisoning your body. Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:10:17] Zach: Whereas food take, that's more of like a, you have to be consistently good or consistently bad to like make, really make a difference. 

[00:10:25] Olivia: Yeah, that's true. But it doesn't take a lot though, like consistently bad for a couple of days you're gonna feel it and then consistently good for a couple days, you're also gonna feel it.

Or like even just consistently bad for one day. I'm feeling 

[00:10:39] Zach: it. Yeah. I remember during, uh, like the height of quarantine. I was on like a health kick. I wasn't drinking at all and I was eating really well and working out all the time. And I did the loneliest thing that I've ever done. Which is, I turned a corner in my apartment and there was a mirror there and I saw a reflection of myself and I was looking real good cause I was taking care of myself.

And I just without, I feel like I hadn't seen any human shape in like days cause of quarantine. And so I was just like, Hey, looking good buddy. And then I hadn't heard anyone say anything in so long that I just reactively went, Hey thanks

And it was all genuine too. There's no one there for me to be, be doing a bit for

[00:11:30] Olivia: Someone should have told you that You were looking good. 

[00:11:33] Zach: There's no one 

[00:11:33] Olivia: around. I guess that was my job. I was like the only person seeing you every day during 

[00:11:41] Zach: quarantine. That's true. Yeah. What the hell? This might have been when we were working from home for like that one 

[00:11:47] Olivia: week or when they put me in the room and I could only see you through the window and we'd leave sticky notes on the, on the window.

[00:11:55] Zach: Yeah. 

[00:11:57] Olivia: Sad times. Boo. That job 

[00:11:58] Victor: sucked. Still find it so funny that like you guys were doing drawings, you're both good at drawing and your boss at the ti the boss they had at the time they saw, saw this drawing and then got like, really worked up about it mm-hmm. and like offended that they themselves didn't like, weren't good at drawing.

Yeah. And made like a big deal about like, you think that's what it, they were like an illustrator or something. 

[00:12:24] Olivia: She, so she got really pissed at me for doodling, um, during shows like, it, it, it is the kind of thing where it's like, it, it doesn't take all your brain power. Like I can doodle but I couldn't like work on other stuff during this.

Anyway, she got. She was livid when she saw that I was drawing. And um, this is after I 

[00:12:47] Zach: left, 

[00:12:48] Olivia: I think so I think it was actually right after you left this. This was like immediately after you left. I remember because I was working, I was working on a doodle that I was going to give to you. Um, and I never got to because yeah, sad.

Um, it was a riddle by the way. Anyway, um, she like got mad that I was drawing and was like, yeah, that's not productive or whatever. But then for like a week she would go on her own show and like talk about how she was an artist and how like when she moved to Seattle she designed her own back tattoo and that, um, unfortunately she found out because uh, she went in to get the tattoo and they did one line and she found out that she's very allergic to tattoo ink and so she couldn't get her ta back tattoo.

Um, which I think it 

[00:13:33] Zach: probably just hurts. I think they're all kinds of tattoo inks. Yeah. Like I think they have, well I don't know when she tried this, but pretty sure they have hypoallergenic ink. Yeah. Anyway. That's funny. I never heard that. I would've assumed it was cuz we were distracting each other.

Not just because there's talent in the 

[00:13:49] Olivia: room. No. Yeah. I think she didn't like that we were better at it than her. 

[00:13:54] Victor: I just remember you telling me one thing where it's like she'd been getting mad at you guys about the drawings and then in some meeting she started talking about how she was like a really good artist Yeah.

Or something. And I was like, where is this coming 

[00:14:05] Olivia: from? Yeah. She kept talking about, for like a week she would talk about, um, like her paintings and stuff and I've never seen anything. Yeah. Never seen any of her 

[00:14:15] Zach: words. I don't remember her ever talking about that . But it is the doodling during shows. Like that's, there's certain, certain brains just work that way.

[00:14:24] Olivia: I remember. Yeah. That's for me is just like a thing that I have to do to pay attention. 

[00:14:28] Zach: I had that called out for me the first time in like 12th grade math. Mm-hmm. . Cause I, I sat in the front row and I, I doodled through throughout class. Like I did every other class. Mm-hmm. . But this was the first teacher he was actually like, I don't think it was part of his lecture.

He was just talking about like the different intelligences and how D brains work differently. And he pointed at me and he was like, for example, this kid draws through every class that I, that I teach . And he gets a's on the tests, that's just how his brain learns the information. And I was like, you know, I'm drawing

I thought I was being slick about it. 

[00:15:09] Olivia: Yeah, we were just talking about this yesterday. Um, and just how like the school system is really designed for a particular person and like, I actually don't even really think that like that is the standard learner. Like I think that there are all kinds of different ways that people learn and like neuro divergence is like much more.

Broad, like in the sense that all, all kinds of people have different ways that their brains process things and, and like, we're all just trying to like fit the mold that they have created for this one particular kind of student, you know? 

[00:15:49] Zach: Yeah. I think that's very true. 

[00:15:52] Victor: Like, since I heard it, I think a lot about the, um, some people think verbally, some people don't thing, you know, it's like some people have, like, I have like a internal monologue going and like when I think thoughts, they usually are in words and like language is kind of like how my brain communicates with itself.

But then some people, like, they do not think words in their head. Mm-hmm. and like, it's usually like pictures or some kinda like visual experience for them. Yeah. And then they have to go through like a conscious process to convert that into language or vice versa. Right. There's just different way of brains 

[00:16:30] Olivia: operating.

Yeah. And there's some people who like literally cannot use their mind's eye. Like they like, 

[00:16:37] Zach: oh yeah, we were talking about this with the ball and table. Uhhuh. . 

[00:16:40] Olivia: Yeah. Oh yeah, we did talk about this. Yeah. Like some people can't imagine something or like see something in their imagination. I'm like, I feel like maybe a lot of people I know I fall in like a middle place where I'm, my brain is definitely very visual, but I also have a lot of like language and I, I hear I have an internal monologue going at the same time.

[00:17:01] Victor: Yeah. But it's like, how many other differences are there, you know? Mm-hmm. between like all the different various ways that our brains function that we're just not aware of cuz there's no good way to study it or document it or whatever. I just 

[00:17:13] Olivia: think like infinite, like I think there's all kinds of variations of different things and like different combinations of different ways that people's brains work might create other ways of learning.

It's something that's really hard to. Study. Right? It's 

[00:17:30] Victor: like how do you know if like the blue you see is like the same 

[00:17:34] Zach: blue that I see . My mom blew my mind with that when I was like five years old or whatever. . That was my introduction of philosophy. Yeah. Yeah. I think I might have mentioned it when we were talking about a mind's eye thing, but I have a buddy that I found out recently does not just has no mind, like he cannot picture things.

Mm-hmm. at all. So I guess he thinks entirely in words which would explain why he's so funny. Mm. When it comes to like wordplay and stuff. Yeah, because, and so I wonder if like a lot of funny people have a similar brain cuz they'll say something like, you know, the root of humor is like unexpectedness usually.

That's usually the funniest thing is the thing you don't expect and he'll say something that's so just not what I would've thought of either. Cuz it's clever with it's word choice or specific and it's word choice. 

[00:18:28] Victor: Yeah, I think there's definitely, I mean, I, I can't say definitively, but I would imagine the people that are good writers and, you know, I'd consider like a comedian, uh, in that same vein, right?

Like, there's probably like a different kind of word processing, like language processing going on in their heads, you 

[00:18:47] Olivia: know? Right. And like, I think you are, like, you're the writer type, you know? Um, and I think that that's like a strength of yours is just communication in general. I also think you're funny , but 

[00:19:01] Zach: yeah, it's good.

It's good to have one, one person on the podcast who's good with words, , and there's word medium. 

[00:19:10] Olivia: I'm good with dreams. 

[00:19:11] Zach: So, yeah. I'm, I think my brain's closer to yours, Olivia, where it's like, I do have an inner monologue. Like that's how I process things, is I have a voice in my head that talks to me.

Sounded like a crazy person. , 

[00:19:26] Victor: uh, Does it, does it tell you to do 

[00:19:28] Zach: things ? Yeah, but it's stuff I wanted to do anyway. . . Uh, but, but I'm also very visual, so like when I write and I don't write a lot of pros, it's mostly like screenplays. Mm-hmm. . So I, I'm picturing the thing vividly in my head and then I mm-hmm. , I have to sort of like, sift through the words, find the right one, the right ones to describe it.


[00:19:51] Olivia: Yeah. That's interesting. That's exactly my experience 

[00:19:53] Victor: too. That's very interesting. I'd never thought about that before, but like, yeah, like, cuz I'm less of a visual thinker, right. It's like hard for me to, I can, I can picture stuff in my brain, but it's like very ephemeral and I'll like fade out pretty easily or changed pretty easily.

And, um, yeah. So it's hard for me to like, hold a scene in my brain or like visually picture like a complex 

[00:20:15] Olivia: thing happening. Ah, that's so interesting. Well, because like, for me it's like those things go together, like the description of a thing. Is the thing kind of mm-hmm. . So like for me, it's like I see the dusty road going through the trees, and then I think that's a dusty road going through the trees, 

[00:20:36] Victor: but like, okay.

So I, I can't remember which philosopher was talking about, like, you got concrete examples of thing and then the abstract, like perfect version of it. But like, if I say chair to you mm-hmm. , do you picture mm-hmm. a specific chair. Yeah. So just the word chair, like evokes like a, like specific detail you're picturing like wood i 

[00:20:59] Olivia: in your kitchen.

I pictured the wooden, I pictured our kitchen chairs. 

[00:21:03] Victor: Gotcha. Versus when I say chair, I have like an abstract concept of chair and then I can attach things to. As needed. But, um, but yeah, I don't immediately need to like, create a physical structure to the thing to think about it. When 

[00:21:19] Olivia: you said abstract concept of chair, my brain just flipped through 30 different 

[00:21:24] Victor: chairs.

Right? See, so that's like, that's a total, like, I have like a art physical like concept of chair that I can hold in my brain. Well, you have to sit, you can be like, oh, you mean a variety of chairs? . Yeah. Right? It's like a yeah, it's a different thing. 

[00:21:40] Zach: Yeah. I think that would explain why like, I'm somewhere in between you two when it comes to remembering dreams.

Like Olivia's one of the most vivid dreamers I've ever met, right? Uh, and I do have vivid dreams, but I don't always remember them. And then you're on the other side. And then when Victor remembers his dreams, it's not, I feel like there's a lot of clear language. Like, I don't know if it's like you, what you thought of while you were dreaming or like retroactively, like explaining it, but like the, um, The carrot and potatoes dream.

Yeah. Like you retelling that felt like, um, like a short story as opposed to some, some when, when a lot of people actually recount their dreams. It's like, you know, it's like my mom, but it wasn't. And then like , I was in this place. It was like a school, but it was a hospital . Right. So, I don't know. That's interesting.

Yeah. The next, I was staying at my buddy Connor's place. He lives, he has a one bedroom, like across the street from his girlfriend who also has a one bedroom. Hmm. So for the week of the wedding, he just went across the street and just stayed at her place. And so I just got to use his place like a hostel.

Oh, that's cool. But the, the morning after the wedding, I was having brunch with him and he called me and he was like, the first thing he said, so what's the name of the young lady in my bed right now? I was like, there isn't one

But I was just having fun talking all the fucking cool ass people at your wedding. There was like too many interesting conversations to be had to like be on the prowl, you know what I mean? 

[00:23:34] Olivia: I put so much effort into seating people for dinner with people that I thought that they would like super get along with.

So like nailed it. Hell yeah. Because I was sitting, I love to hear it. 

[00:23:49] Zach: I was sitting right. To Tim Segueway into the 

[00:23:53] Olivia: segue. Our friend Tim sent us a dream that, uh, is that it's, it's interesting because both Victor and I are in the dream. Um, oh it is. Which is maybe the first time that that has happened from an outside Dreamer.

Um, and then I've got, well, that we know of. Right, right, right, right, right, right. We could be plaguing the dreams of all of our listeners and have no idea. Um 

[00:24:21] Zach: Right. And do we have permission to use his 

[00:24:24] Victor: name? Tim has no pride or shame, so he's happy for us to use his 

[00:24:28] Olivia: name. Okay. Also, um, Tim told us to watch The Science of Sleep last night.

Have you seen that movie? No. It's like Dream Logic merging with reality. He said it's a must watch for dream obsessed, artsy weirdos. It's the most Olivia shit ever conceived by the minds of men. . 

[00:24:46] Zach: Oh, it's Michelle Gondry. Yes. 

[00:24:49] Victor: Yeah, it's. 

[00:24:50] Zach: Science, fantasy. Comedy. 

[00:24:53] Olivia: All right. Um, so Tim sent us a dream, uh, side note.

This is in a group chat with, um, me and Victor and Hannah, who is Tim's girlfriend. And Tim. And Tim says, I had this crazy nightmare. The four of us hiked up to the top of this snowy mountain, and there was a spooky cabin. We were all going to stay the night in before we all went to sleep. Victor took two photographs of the room because he felt uneasy about the room.

The next day, he had two developed photos. One was the room, but there was this demonn that looked like a super scary Abraham Lincoln grinning with like jagged shark teeth. The second photo was an extreme closeup of those crazy teeth. We were all so freaked we went running from the cabin, but we all had that classic slow running panic you get in nightmares.

Okay. And because Tim is a super talented guy, he drew elements of this dream. And I'm going to text them to you 

[00:25:56] Zach: Zachary, and this will be great. Once we have visual component. 

[00:26:01] Olivia: Hell yeah. We're gonna put it on the gram 

[00:26:03] Zach: a drum. Um, yes. That's as As opposed to take a photogram. . 

[00:26:09] Victor: It's very good. Yeah, 

[00:26:10] Zach: it's very stylized.

[00:26:12] Victor: So just to reiterate, like, okay, four of us go up to a cabin, it's creepy, I take pictures and then the next morning we look at the pictures and it reveals a monster that Abraham Lincoln with shark teeth. Mm-hmm. that we didn't see during the night. And then we're freaked out and we leave. 

[00:26:30] Zach: So, is that right?

Some kinda like 24 hour development type of camera. Like an old school camera. Yeah. 

[00:26:36] Olivia: Yeah. I like that it's, um, the first one is Abraham Lincoln with shark teeth, and then the second one is just a closeup of the teeth. Kind of like in between the two photographs he got close to you, you know? Yeah. That's spooky.

Oh, I have not read this because I, I've been holding back, but I was very stoked to see that there is a Dream Bible entry for Abraham Lincoln. Okay. 

[00:27:00] Victor: So I pulled up cabin pictures cause that's what they had for photography, Abe Lincoln and Fangs, uh, which seemed like the closest analog to shark teeth. Yeah.

Um, so Abraham Lincoln may represent an aspect of your personality that leads others by being a role model or a mentor, an ability to guide others with good advice and valuable experience. 

[00:27:26] Olivia: I'm gonna add, so it, it says the picture was this demonn that looked like a scary Abraham Lincoln. Gotcha. So let's pull up Demonn.

[00:27:37] Zach: Yeah. Cause there's no Abraham Lincoln negatively, right? 

[00:27:41] Olivia: No, no. And it's , it's a little spooky that the, that it's, um, an aspect of yourself that leads others by being a role model. But in, in combination with like a demonic thing is an, an interesting 

[00:27:56] Victor: Yeah. It suggests like a, like a corruption of that role or something.

Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. , yeah. To dream of a demonn represents an aspect of your personality that is noticeably antagonistic to anything positive. It reflects problematic people situations or your own bad habits that are totally motivated by negativity. It may also reflect people or situations that seem to actively work against you or your own shadow self that prefers negative choices, destruction, addictions.

You can't resist an area if, an area of your life where you are experiencing torment, repressed urges, or unacceptable urges. Feelings about people or situations being evil in the method they interfere with your goals. Uh, a demon may also reflect people or situations that never allow you to break free of a problem.

Also, jealousy or bitterness that seems personal. Ignorance. Distress or meaning or, or meanness feeling as though someone is out to get you. So like a blinken is you rep you presenting like a, like a leadership role or like a mentor role to people. And then a demonn is like all of the like negative, all of your shit, all of your baggage and the reasons why, why you are a problem or not, like self-actualized or whatever.

[00:29:13] Olivia: So is that like, to me it sounds like that that could mean like being a bad role model or like negatively influencing others 

[00:29:22] Victor: Right. Or discomfort with that role. Yeah. When you're like 

[00:29:25] Zach: combining the two to get that right. Yeah. Yeah. And it's interesting that Victor took the pictures. Like, um, yeah. Hmm. Like, maybe because he's, maybe there's like a latent worry that like if these four people that he's close to, or three people that he's close to, like saw him in an isolated environment, like a cabin that, uh, I don't know.

Hmm. I'm just starting to put stuff, stuff together without, like, more context on Tim, so maybe I'll save it. Yeah. Uh, 

[00:29:55] Victor: well, so to, to get into fangs really quick, uh, fangs in a dream may reflect anger or a fear of someone intentionally choosing to hurt you. A fear of being eaten alive by an angry person, authority figure or dangerous situation, an aggressor in your life.

Uh, an animal fangs or represent feelings about person or situation being terrifying. If someone with fang scares you, this may reflect a waking life problem that is starting to scare you. A fear of having to notice yourself being totally overtaken by your problem. Hmm. So it could be like, um, So like you've got a blinken, which is like you, um, like a, like a self that is presenting positively to other people and being looked up to and being respected by other people.

You've got the demonn, which is like all of your shit and all of your baggage, and then you've got fangs, which is like real life stress that is like, you know, getting to you. 

[00:30:55] Olivia: Or like if you do combine all of them, like, let's see it, or the part that says if someone with fangs scares you, um, waking life problem that is starting to scare you.

A fear of having to notice yourself being o totally overtaken by your problem that like the Abe Lincoln as a demonn feels like yourself. Being overtaken by your problem? Like in and of itself, you know? Right. The teeth kind of like, is the cherry on top there? 

[00:31:26] Victor: Yeah. The teeth. I think the teeth specifically point to stress.

Yeah. Being like the, or like, uh, external factors. Maybe bringing something negative out for you. Mm-hmm. or like, um, affecting you deeply on some level. Mm-hmm. , do we want to get into the other details first or do we wanna hit like, cabin and 

[00:31:47] Zach: photography? Yeah. I'm also curious about pictures. Cause I, I feel, I feel like there's a significance to like one of his friends taking the picture as opposed to him taking it.

Right. Yeah. 

[00:31:56] Olivia: Well, let's look at that. Let's look at pictures then 

[00:31:59] Victor: to dream of a picture or photograph represents a memory or mental imprint of an experience you had. How a situation was remembered or is perceived by you after it has occurred. A lasting impression ensuring remembrance. To dream of taking pictures may reflect in importance you feel or remembering current actions at a later time.

A wish to remember yourself as having done the right thing negatively. Pictures may reflect a bad memory of yourself, memories of yourself having made a mistake, not stood up for yourself or having embarrassed yourself. A bad impression of our past behavior or actions. Remembering something bad, trying to manipulate how an event is remembered.

Alternatively, it may reflect an intentional choice to take action so that something will be remembered in a negative way. Look to the content of the picture for other symbolism to help you understand what kind of impressions certain experiences left on. 

[00:32:56] Olivia: So, yeah, it is interesting that Victor's taking the picture.

[00:33:00] Victor: Um, yeah, so like, so for some context there, like me and Tim go way back. Yeah. Do, like, we knew each other in college and I've known him the longest of anyone involved in that group 

[00:33:09] Olivia: of people. And it like, if a picture is like, uh, remembering the past, right, and it's, and if we're saying that a, this Abe Lincoln is like a representation of some aspect of Tim or something that Tim sees in himself, it's interesting that like you are the one who took the picture there.

So what would, what did it say there, um, memories of yourself having made a mistake, not stood up for yourself or having embarrassed yourself a bad impression on past behavior or actions. Yeah. Like, I mean, I don't know if I'm like to look at that objectively. It's like maybe a concern that like, about something in your history or like in Tim's past that, that you would be the only person who could see or knew about.

[00:33:52] Victor: Right. I, I think that makes a certain amount of sense. I mean, me and Tim like knew each other in college when we were younger men we're, we're a decade down the road, uh, now. And I think both feel like we've grown and changed and like, oh God, I did X, Y, z, embarrassing thing. Or Oh, I, I'm a different person now than I was mm-hmm.

And so, um, I could see maybe if, if you take the a blinken thing as like, uh, I feel like I'm, I'm presenting myself in the best light, like I am being the version of me that I want to be right now. But there's like, uh, I know that there's more to me, right? I know that like there's some negativity attached to me.

Mm-hmm. , I have my own shit. I have my own, like, I'm a person with problems. Right. You know, I am not a perfect person. And part of that for you is like your past, right? Um, yeah, it makes a lot of sense to me to like maybe have an anxiety of like, like I, I could certainly understand, uh, Tim maybe having some kind of anxiety of like, oh, I remember like a, like an embarrassing story.

Or it's like, you know, uh, shifting perceptions of him when he's probably worked hard to become the person that he is. And I would feel the same way, 

[00:35:16] Olivia: you know? Mm-hmm. . Yeah. Yeah. That seems like a pretty universal sentiment too. Like, I just feel like everybody probably feels that way on some level with the people that saw them in their like, early formative years.

You know, like, yeah. 

[00:35:29] Zach: I could easily put myself in a position where I'm with, you know, My current girlfriend and my buddy's wife, and then my buddy who I go way back with, like right to these other two, to the ladies. Like they, they're seeing the, the Abe Lincoln of it all, but this guy in the middle, like he knows, he knows , right?

Like he knows about 

[00:35:50] Victor: the teeth . Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And like, I, I feel that back, right? Mm-hmm. like, to some degree, like I know that Tim knows a totally different version of me and like probably knows like, uh, stupid shit that I did when I was 20, you know? And, and 

[00:36:06] Olivia: I feel that same way in other group dynamics where like, You know me very well, but you know, the me I am today and have been for the last few years, right.

Versus some of the people that I go way back with know me from when I was 20 or when I was, you know, 16. And like that's a different version of me and I, right? I, this is, I feel like this is very, very relatable. 

[00:36:31] Zach: Especially with, uh, you know, somebody you've known a long time cuz they're, that's somebody you're interacting with and around that is like a historian of your many different personalities over the years.

You know, sometimes I, I cringe like remembering like they're people that I don't know anymore and the only version of me that they are walking around out in the world with is like my least favorite. Right. 

[00:36:56] Victor: And like it's important context of like, me and Tim have not been like close friends for the last decade.

We were, we were like in a band together. Mm-hmm. and I always liked Tim and uh, I was always very talented and, um, we were close as uh, band mates Right. And we were friends. Um, and then we like drifted apart and then spent a long time mm-hmm. not really talking, not cuz anything happened, but just cuz line of life and he moved to Arizona.

Right. And like yeah. Just kind of drifted away. So it's not just that I'm someone he is known for a long time. I'm someone that knew him at a specific time of his life. Um, and you're sort 

[00:37:34] Olivia: of reconnecting. 

[00:37:35] Victor: Exactly. Right. So yeah, it's totally rational if maybe. I, uh, at least in this dream, represents some kind of like reminder of like a past that maybe he sits like a little uncomfortably with, or wishes could be forgotten or done away with or whatever.

It's like I'm maybe unbearing some latent embarrassment of like, oh man, when I was, you know, 24. 

[00:38:03] Olivia: Yeah. You know. Well, and, and it is interesting that, um, so the four of us have hung out a few times recently and like, I like Tim and Hannah quite a bit. They're like the kinds of people that I really connect with and I feel really seen.

And like we all just get along really great and everybody understands each other and everybody just has a good time. And like, si like since we've been hanging out, we've been like talking a lot and developing like a new friendship with the four of us. Right. And so, um, but there's like that other part of that.

Four person dynamic that is the two person dynamic of, or there's three, two person dynamics really? Is that like there's Tim and Hannah, there's you and me, and there's you and Tim because you and Tim have additional history outside of the four of us. Right? 

[00:38:56] Victor: Oh, I see what 

[00:38:56] Zach: you're saying. That makes sense.


[00:38:57] Victor: the mathematics that Tim, I was sitting here, wait a minute, but there's a connection. You and two and Tim are dating, and then me and Hannah and Hannah know each other. Like, there's like, there's other independence. Those 

[00:39:06] Olivia: are the core, like, yeah. Yeah. No, I, I mean, yeah, I guess me and Hannah and me and Tim are all still getting to know each other more.

And then you and Hannah also have like, uh, you've guys have known each other for a while, but not in person, right? Right. Yeah. And so, um, So, yeah, but like the tho that's where there's like the most history, right? Yes. Is in those three, two person dynamics. Yeah. And those are all bringing additional things to the, to the four of us, right?

[00:39:35] Zach: Mm-hmm. , do we want to get into the additional context? Yeah, let's do that because I will say, um, I only know Tim from your wedding. I just met him there. Uh, but it was pretty funny. I talked to him for a long time and it was just one of those like, almost weird, like we're we're like the same person almost like every time.

I think those were Tim's exact words. He's like, damn, we're like the same person. It's like every time one conversation ended, another, the other person would bring up like something random and like niche like Tim and Eric. And then when he brought Tim, Tim and Eric, they're only, I dunno if you guys are fans, but it's.

Pretty niche show that has like its own world around it. And it's, when you meet somebody else's into it, you just go down a rabbit hole of like, oh dude, you remember this one? You remember that one? Yeah. , like just nerding out about the lore of it. Yeah. 

[00:40:27] Olivia: No, I feel like you and Tim are very similar 

[00:40:29] Zach: people.

It was like, um, like a stepbrothers moment. You wouldn't go do karate in the garage. Yep. 

[00:40:35] Olivia: So, uh, I took a tip from Dream Bible and I asked Tim, what's been on your mind the most the last few days? Tim says There have been layoffs at work. Not only was this handled in a shitty, non-communicative way, but I've inherited, inherited a ton of work.

A lot of the assignments, the laid off employees had our months overdue, so suddenly I have a deadline. Anxiety for reasons beyond my control. Morale has dipped and company culture is at an all time low. There's a general feeling of dread around the office. Aside from that, I've felt a bit spammy about pushing the album and highlighting reviews, but I've been happy with the reception to such bizarre subject matter.

I think making the album brought a lot of darker death obsessed pieces of my subconscious to the surface. Um, also let's push Tim's album cuz it's very cool and people need to go to it. 

[00:41:26] Victor: We gotta plug this album. Have you listened to this? I have you heard it? No. Gross. All right. You got 

[00:41:32] Olivia: homework. You gotta do that.

You should listen to it. It's very cool. Um, the decline of the flies and the rise of spiders. By Tim mek,

the white zone symbols produced by the 

[00:41:46] Zach: unconscious. 

[00:41:48] Olivia: Oh, hey there, this is Olivia from the future, or actually kind of like more from the present. And uh, what you've been hearing is Olivia from the past. Yeah, that's accurate. Uh, I'm just jumping in here to say that since we recorded this episode in October of 2022, has actually put out two more albums.

Yeah. He's prolific af There's a Christmas album called Happy Holidays, a festive family friendly holiday extravaganza, which I highly recommend. And there is Unhatched Horrors in Technol, which is just spectacular. And you also might recognize a voice there on the opening truck. It's called Snooze Button.

That's me. I'm doing some voiceover. It was a huge honor. Yeah. Uh, Tim's really cool and talented. Go check out his stuff. Uh, if you like music. All right. Uh, back to Olivia from the past, taken Away. Okay. Here, she's Tim. M e c h l i n g. Tim Ling. Yes. Go to Bandcamp. 

[00:42:59] Zach: It's funny that at the top of this we're like, does he need a pseudonym?

Yeah. We realized. Uh, plug his thing. It's like, yeah, 

[00:43:09] Olivia: that would've been done. Um, but it's very, it's a very cool album. I told him it sounded like a synesthetic journey through hell. Um, but like in a good way. You wanna go back? Yeah. 

[00:43:20] Victor: Uh, 

[00:43:21] Zach: I've read Dante's Inferno like six time, so 

[00:43:23] Olivia: go listen to Tim's album.

Hello. Okay. Most honest feelings about the people in this dream. Tim says, all our friends and creative comrades. I think we're a creative group of folks. I've known Victor for about a decade, but we haven't seen much of each other until earlier this year. We went from music collaborators to coworkers, to distant coworkers, back to music collaborators.

I think he's a brilliant songwriter and an understated. Hannah is the apple of my eye. We've known each other for maybe six years, and we've had a long distance intrigue in one another for a long time, but thought it would never happen then it did. She knows her way around a violin and we've collaborated quite a bit in the last year.

Olivia is a surprise, kindred spirit. It turns out we have the same love of weird music, ween, LCD sound system, blah, blah, blah. Bitter psychopathic drinks and a whimsy slash wonder about this absurd old world. Um, any additional details, colors, feelings, little things that you might not have thought were important?

So here's where Tim drops a fucking bomb on us, and there's like a whole other part to this dream with like a shit ton of characters. Um, so. Here we go. He goes sharing the cabin where these bizarre white trash mechanic types. And one of them was an older gentleman that was so obese. He was a near sphere.

One of them was an older gal that had that weird reptilian skin, lifelong smokers get, add to that, an ugly tan and sparse hair up top, low husky voice, a rattling phlegm laden cough. Another might have been their kid, a classic overweight O in overalls. And the va and the vacant eyed smile found only in the dumbest of dumb dumbs.

The three of them occupied a room down the hall from us and there were like 20 flies circling their room and there was this old broken down car in their room and they were apparently trying to fix it through the dream, they kept intruding into our, into our room and inserting themselves into our conversations.

I can't remember what we or they were talking about, but I remember them being annoying as hell. And um, now I'm gonna send you the rest of the drawings that he did. . Oh, there's more. Yeah, there's 

[00:45:35] Zach: three more. Like this Texas chainsaw Oscar family. Kind of funny how descriptive he got with, with these tertiary hairs.

Looks like this Looks like an adult swim cartoon. 

[00:45:50] Olivia: Yeah. . Oh, there's a white trash entry in the Dream Bible. 

[00:45:54] Victor: a white trash in the dream Bible. I also found rednecks, but I feel like white trash is more. Should I get right into it? Alright. Yeah. Jump on in. Before we do white trash, I'm gonna do cabins To dream of a wood cabin represents a wish to be alone or to do something by yourself.

You may need your privacy or don't feel like talking to anybody. Okay. 

[00:46:16] Olivia: Not a meeting. That's interesting that we're going there together. It was also snowy. I remember snow Mike. 

[00:46:22] Victor: Hmm. 

[00:46:22] Zach: In the first round of questions that you've asked him, I think the. The thing that stuck out the most was, to me, was about his self-consciousness regarding releasing his album.

Mm-hmm. , because we did, I did talk to him about that at the, the wedding, cuz I, yeah. He's doing a lot better job than I ever have cuz I, I share that same self-consciousness. I hate self-promoting. And I have a couple releases out there that, like 12 people I've heard because I'm so adverse to even telling friends about it, let alone, like, trying to figure out how to market it to strangers.

Yeah. Um, and this very much feels like it could be about that, you know what I mean? Like the, maybe the a a Lincoln thing has less to do with virtue and more to do with like creative integrity. 

[00:47:11] Victor: Hmm 

[00:47:11] Olivia: mm-hmm. . Yeah. Or like the, like Demonn could be more like a preoccupation with. Like being perceived as, or feeling like narcissistic in your, in your manner of like presenting yourself or putting yourself out there.


[00:47:28] Zach: Yeah. Or the, you know, more submerged, death obsessed part of his personality than he mentioned in that other part of his answers. You know, like, like some feeling, some, uh, I don't know what the cha not, I dunno if shame's the right word. Embarrassment, maybe the, the, uh, uh, that's how he's going to be perceived feeling by me, by music critics or 

[00:47:48] Victor: whomever.

Feeling like you've compromised yourself in some way. Mm-hmm. . 

[00:47:54] Olivia: Yeah. So, or that you're doing your music for like the, the reason you're doing it, right, like that, I feel like making music, it never really works if you're making it for like other people or to like, for any reason other than self-expression.

And then that's kind of like a weird juxtaposition when you're then trying to like, promote it and push it to the other people, even if you made it for yourself as an expression of 

[00:48:20] Zach: yourself, you know? Yeah. So if this cabin is like an inclination to like, isolate, and he is going there with like three people that are close to him that he sees as creative comrades that he trusts to share this vision with, but right next door is a bunch of mouth breathing mongrels that keep trying to like butt in on your conversation.

Like that, that could be a, a, a fear of just John Q Public, you know, like misconstruing, uh, the heart and soul that he put into 

[00:48:52] Victor: this project. Yeah, let's roll into white trash then to dream of people you feel are white. Trash may reflect feelings about yourself or others being low class cheap or unconcerned with low quality behavior, a lack of con concern for some area of your life.

Staying unattractive, an area of your life where you feel other people prefer to behave without integrity or low standards as though it were normal. When you feel it isn't a lack of sophistication, feelings about yourself or someone else. Being a low life, negatively white trash people may reflect your feelings about others being other people, preferring low quality choices, ignorance or improved possibilities or potential, a lack of sophistication that holds back progress.

Low standards or low quality that scares you. Feeling or fearing being pulled down to other people's low standards of behavior, anxiety about others thinking you are a lowlife loser. Alternatively, dreaming about white trash. People may reflect feelings about yourself having low standards and not caring about it at all.

Some area of your life where you prefer low standards or low quality because it makes you happy. Accepting yourself as a low life, not caring what people think of you. He 

[00:50:05] Olivia: talks about feeling like spammy, and that, I would say is like a low life behavior. If it like, like being spammy is like, kind of like a ugh Yeah.

Feels kind thing, 

[00:50:18] Zach: right? Feels inci. Right. Especially when it, if it's like potentially to this, this crowd of people with low quality tastes, you know? Mm-hmm. . 

[00:50:28] Victor: Yeah. So it seems like, um, demonn pointing towards like some insecurity or like some, some like dealing with your own shit. Um, the, the fangs are pointing towards external stressors, and then the white trash people are pointing towards like, Anxiety about, um, how yourself is, how you were being perceived by others or how you were perceiving other people in a way that's like grading on you a little bit.

Mm-hmm. . So yeah. It sounds like just like a lot of, uh, external stress, which seems to connect to the two things he was pointing to, right? Mm-hmm. of like work being stressful and then the album. Yeah. He's stressed. I think he just, he said he was stressed, so this is all just reiterating when he was stressed.

I dunno 

[00:51:11] Zach: why I'm, I think it does have to do with that, like, this is my feeling anyway, that has to do with that like, specific stress around breaking the barrier between like just sharing your art with your friends that, you know, will be supportive and being, you know, defying every impulse you have to not be spammy to get it out there to people who may not even appreciate it.

Yeah. Um, in the interest of expanding cabin, you know, in search of more, yeah. An audience. I guess I was gonna say more like-minded people, but that would be his audience's. People like you guys that would. 

[00:51:45] Olivia: Right. Yeah. Yeah. And 

[00:51:47] Zach: as I listen, I will listen to him. 

[00:51:49] Olivia: So like, this album is definitely like a thing that is not gonna be everybody's cup of tea.

Like it's, it's experimental for sure. It's very cool. It's definitely my thing. But like, I, I can see why that would feel, especially like, um, a concern if you're, If you're putting out something that you know is not going to be fully appreciated, 

[00:52:12] Zach: you know these archetypes that are in the next room are like, how did you put it near Sphere?

You don't get, you don't get that big eating like deconstructed five star, you know, gourmet. You, you get that big on McDonald's. You see what I'm saying? His music's not McDonald's . Yeah. 

[00:52:29] Olivia: Yeah. It's not. Well, and how do you push your, how do you push your unconventional album and get it to the people who are going to like be able to appreciate it?

You just have to push it to everybody and. Some people are not gonna like it. Some people are not gonna listen to it. It's hard to get it to the right audience. 

[00:52:47] Zach: Right? Yeah. That's the hard part about the, like, experimental music is not only will people not get it, but some people will think it's bad because they don't get it.


[00:52:55] Olivia: But really they're bad low lives, , low quality 

[00:52:59] Victor: people, . But I, I do feel like the, the photograph thing and Abe Lincoln probably, probably represents some. Makes him self-consciousness. What I'm getting from this is maybe that he's feeling stressed and vulnerable. Mm-hmm. and he's got the people he doesn't care about over there, but that are causing him stress.

And then he is got people that he likes and respects and thinks like, get him. Mm-hmm. . And I think the photograph and then this monster represent maybe some anxiety that the people he actually likes mm-hmm. will maybe like get a, like their perspective of him will be shifted Yeah. In a negative way or something because all this other shit has gone around.


[00:53:44] Olivia: That, that feels like that, that feels like a, a, um, a relatable anxiety. Yeah. I, I also, um, was just thinking about how in the dream, Victor took two pictures of the room. You did not take pictures of a, of Abe Lincoln, the demonn dishonest Abe, um, you, it, it's the kind of thing that didn't show up until later, right?

Mm-hmm. . 

[00:54:10] Zach: Reminds me of that Goosebumps book. Nevermind . You lost me. Goosebump. A Stein. Goosebumps. 

[00:54:19] Victor: Oh, I did. Yeah. I liked goosebumps. I don't know what, I wonder, remember, don't remember what story you're 

[00:54:22] Zach: talking about. There was one with a, like a Polaroid camera that would take pictures of things that weren't there or things that were gonna happen.

Maybe, I can't remember how it was a 

[00:54:29] Victor: child. Gotcha. I might, I might just be like, projecting this onto Tim because this is a thing that like I wrestle with of like, oh, like I don't like myself. I've, I'm embarrassed by like stupid stuff that I've done. Like, oh, the people that like me, they're gonna figure out that I'm a big idiot.

That causes all sorts of, like, that's the kind of anxiety that I have to like constantly try to push back against, you know? I know that's silly, but it's still kind of. Haunts me a little bit. And so maybe I'm like projecting that onto Tim when it's more of a me 

[00:55:01] Olivia: thing. I mean, I feel like that what you're describing is like a quality that I only see in, um, self-reflective people who I like to hang out with.

Yeah, I was gonna say, 

[00:55:12] Zach: it also sounds like a me thing. So there's a, there's a good likelihood it's a Tim thing too. I 

[00:55:16] Olivia: think that people who don't feel that way sometimes, like obviously it's not great to feel that way all the time. That's not healthy either. But like most of the people I meet who are walking around like, yeah, I'm great are not usually people that I, um, the Dunning Kruger effect, like 

[00:55:32] Victor: with.

[00:55:34] Zach: Yeah. Well maybe if the cabin is like his mental universe in which he created this album, you know, he's bringing you guys there deliberately. Cause he trusts you, but he's afraid that one of you, the one that knows him the most, might unveil something by taking a snapshot of it that, uh, or just like yeah.

Is inherent in the space. That's not necessarily true, but it's something that he's wrestling with. Hmm. 

[00:55:57] Olivia: Yeah. Uh, or that just like, like that Victor might have, um, a different perception of all of this like, of all of, I mean, of, of Tim or of his album or of like, whatever, just based on having more context and like the context of knowing him when he was in his early twenties, which like, I'm not, most people at that age are doing shit that we're all embarrassed about later.

Oh yeah. And like, um, big time. 

[00:56:29] Victor: Yeah. Like, like I was talking to Tim a little bit at the, um, at the, uh, bachelor party. We did like a joint bachelor party, so we got everybody together, all our friends together and just went out. We went bowling, we got drunk. It was a good time. Um, but I was talking to Tim and we were talking about like that time of our, our lives, and he, he opened up a little bit about how like he was going through some shit, you know?

Mm-hmm. , like, he felt like, um, and which, It's like kind of that age, like, like 24, 25. It's like you kind of get smacked with like the world being n not maybe what you had hoped it was. Mm-hmm. , you know, and like, or not really knowing who you are and not really having a direction and yeah. Around that same age that I was a couple years later had through like a really dark year, you know, where just like, like no friends didn't know what to do with myself.

Miserable, you know, I think like that time period that I knew him, he, he was describing, he was coming off of like being a touring musician and then landing in a place where he didn't really know what to do with himself and he was depressed and like the world was kind of eating at a little bit. Mm-hmm.

So he may not have liked himself very much at that time where I knew him. And so he might feel like I am a person that's carrying around a version of him that he no longer, you know, wants to identify with. Right. And so if he feels like I, I still see him as being this person that he doesn't like or whatever on some level, right?

It's hard to let go of. 

[00:58:03] Olivia: Absolutely. And like, and that makes sense in the context of you then taking these snapshots and which in the dream Bible, like a photograph, a physical picture, um, can be a representation of a moment in the past, right? Mm-hmm. . Um, and then what you then do is you reveal that to the group.

We didn't all see Abe Lincoln. 

[00:58:26] Victor: I'm gonna read the, the snow entry really quick. Um, to dream of snow on the ground represents an unpleasant, cold, or terrible situation you have to put up with until it completely goes away on its own. A situation that feels unforgivable until it's finished. Uh, a situation that feels so cold that nobody does anything for you.

Suffering with delays or no progress, a lack of momentum in your life, not liking, having to wait harsh and difficult times. Snow may reflect how harsh or cold a cleansing experience is. A very unpleasant, new beginning or feeling as though you're being punished. Emotional isolation, feeling out on the cold or like you got a cold shoulder, a loss, a breakup, or an unpleasant ending of something coldness of a relationship where you are not getting along or talking to each other.

That may take time to pass. Keeping someone else out in the cold. 

[00:59:21] Zach: That part about it being like a cleansing, that's unpleasant. Mm-hmm. caught my ear. 

[00:59:27] Olivia: Yeah, me too. I, I think, um, I think that to me that, um, ties back into, Putting your album out, putting the album out as, as like a, cuz that feels like a, a humbling experience or like, you, you kind of have to let go of a lot of stuff to be able to do that and to push past the discomfort of feeling like you're spamming people with this thing.

Right. Yeah. 

[00:59:51] Victor: And the work stress, right? Yeah. Those things together. Mm-hmm. . Right. It's a lot to try and grapple with at the same time. 

[00:59:58] Zach: Yeah. But the way, yeah. It describes snow as being like a new beginning potentially that going from like a bedroom musician to somebody that like music reviewers are listening to that is like a, you're breaking a membrane there.

It's a new chapter of a musicians. 

[01:00:13] Victor: Uh, yeah, that's true. Yeah. Definitely. 

[01:00:16] Olivia: What do 

[01:00:16] Zach: you guys think? Have I also tend to, like, once I feel like I have an idea of what it's about, I get latched onto it. like, yeah, keep looking for stuff that fits that I did all the cognitive bias about it. Well, I guess 

[01:00:30] Olivia: only Tim can, uh, only Tim will tell.

Only Tim can 

[01:00:35] Victor: tell. Yeah. Thank you for listening to The Jung and the Restless

[01:00:38] Zach: You can follow us on social media at The Jung and the Restless Pod and submit your dreams for interpretation to The Jung and the Restless pod at Gmail. 

[01:00:48] Olivia: And as we always say, even the good Lord, Lord himself gets, 

[01:00:52] Zach: gets the,

the clock is.

[01:01:46] Victor: Wanna take this parasocial relationship to the next level

Well, if you leave us a review on Apple Podcast, we'll read it on the show and then we'll know you exist the same way you know we exist. That's basically like second base in podcasting,

[01:02:05] Zach: How weird is this gonna get if we just keep going?

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