3. Tandem Dreaming

Zach and Olivia sometimes have the same dreams on the same night, and Victor is locked and loaded with his…...

Zach and Olivia sometimes have the same dreams on the same night, and Victor is locked and loaded with his trusty dream bible, ready to get to the bottom of it. The Dream Team discusses Zach and Olivia’s tandem dream that inspired the podcast, as well as the one that occurred the night before the recording of this episode. They ask big questions, like, “can science explain this mysterious phenomenon?” “What is the Collective Unconscious?” And “why Zach is a ginger when he looks in dream mirrors?” Lastly, a dream about a poor, dusty rubber butt, and a frustrated Zach who just can’t seem to get it in. 

0:00 Intro

9:05 Olivia and Zach's Treehouse Dreams

12:42 Olivia's dream

48:48 Zach and Olivia's Rubber Butt Dreams 

About Dream Bible:

Dream Bible is a free online A to Z dream dictionary dedicated to helping people understand the meaning of their dreams. Unlike other dream interpretation websites or books we extensively research dream symbols by interviewing people about the events occurring in their lives at the time of their dreams.  Inspired by the work of Gillian Holloway Ph.D, we are using a database of over 350,000 dream reports to create the world's most practical dream dictionary based on the waking life experiences of regular people.


Dream Bible Entries used in this episode:

Treehouse: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=treehouse

High school: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=high+school

Classrooms: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=classroom

Science: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=science

Hair: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=Hair

Puppeteer: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=puppeteer

Poison: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=poison

Follow us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thejungandtherestlesspod/

Episode Transcript

Victor: [00:00:00] Welcome to The Jung and the Restless. I'm Victor.

Olivia: I'm Olivia 

Zach: And I'm Zach, and this is the podcast where if you're bored, you can just fly away, do a different podcast.

Intro Music

Zach: 1, 3, 

Victor: and again 3, 3, 3, 


Olivia: And here we go. Three, orange, spaghetti, lobster, one.

Victor: So what we were saying before the recording

Zach: Yeah. Olivia's dreams are too complex.

Olivia: So I was using your jerking off dream from last week as [00:01:00] an example, of what I want from my dream, if we're gonna analyze it, because it's like, it's a clear, concise thing that we can talk about.

My dreams lately have just been like epic tales with side plots and like interwoven, through lines and character development.

Zach: But that's compelling

Olivia: Yeah. I, I think I have to accept that we're not fully gonna be able to dissect one of those dreams.

Zach: mine was just like, ah, I was jerking off and I was ashamed.

Olivia: Yeah. And that's easy to analyze

Zach: right. It almost doesn't beg for, for a whole podcast.

Victor: you both have dream envy. You both want dreams more like the other one's dreams

Zach: the Freud and the restless. 

Olivia: Sometimes Zach will have a dream and then I will have Zach's dream. That's happened a few times. 

Zach: Yeah. We've talked about that,

Olivia: about that. Yeah. I think I had Zach's jerking off dream

Zach: but not, not, I wasn't in it though. Right? [00:02:00] Just me toing you 

I wasn't Louis cking you. I hope.

Olivia: No, no, that has also happened where I will have your dream and I will be in your dream and you will also be there

Zach: Cause if I was 

Victor: But that's not what happened.

Zach: if I was there, I, I was trying to get away from people. 

Olivia: right No, I had the, I had the dream, but I was in, I was, I was you in your dream?

Zach: okay.

Victor: so did you recreate the whole dream? Like the jerking off and your parents there? And

Olivia: I like it started off like that and then I think it branched off into something else, but it was like, my brain was like, uh, where, where can we start? Oh yeah. Um, jerking off at your parents' house.

Zach: Oh, you were actually in my dream last night, Olivia

Olivia: You were in my dream last night, Zach,

Zach: Uh, but mine was super creepy. And not in a jerking off way, in like a nightmare way. Uh, and you weren't a big part of it. I don't remember what happened before, but the way it ended is I was sitting [00:03:00] across a table from you and you were doing this thing where you were like,

I like, I couldn't tell if you were laughing or crying, but it, it was like this really creepy mixture of both.

and then

you didn't understand why I was freaked out. And I was trying to explain to you what you were doing, cuz you didn't seem to know that you were doing this with your face. And I was like, you're, you're like cry. You're like sad, laughing and happy crying at the same time. And I tried to imitate it and I woke myself up and I was like doing it out, out loud in bed. And I was like, thank God. I don't have somebody to sleep next to right now cuz that would've creeped them the fuck out to just wake up to me, like imitating the joker.

Olivia: Oh my God. Wake up to me like, oh my God. Um, that's okay. That's creepy also very weird. My dream ended with, um, sitting across, um, from you at a table.

Zach: What

Olivia: Yeah,

Victor: Dream cartography

Zach: was I freaked

out was I [00:04:00] freaked out and you didn't 

Olivia: freaked out There was a weird thing. There was a freaky thing happening, but, um,

Zach: I was jerking off I off

Victor: Okay. So we have to dig into this.


need descriptions of the room descriptions of the table. What were you each wearing? What would we need to find where it overlaps and where it diverges?

Olivia: It's like a white room with fluorescent lighting,

Zach: what the fuck? Yeah, I was gonna, I was gonna say it's like a classroom with like, uh,

Victor: Yeah, 

I was 

Olivia: literally school

Zach: yeah, with like one of those super thin like Pinewood desks.

Olivia: What the 

Zach: That's really weird.

Olivia: really weird.

Victor: Why am I not invited to the dream 

Olivia: parties?

You were in my dream too, but that was a different part. We'll talk about it later. It was very funny.

Zach: Oh man.

Olivia: that's really creepy. so, okay. So in, in my dream, in this part of my dream, we were sitting across from each other at this table in a school, in like a classroom. You were taking Polaroids of a [00:05:00] video.

Like, I don't know, it was weird. We were simultaneously sitting across from each other and I was like, I'm not sure if like I was the girl in the video but you were taking Polaroids of a video of this girl and it was like, 

 She was doing a weird like flappy arm movement, kind of like the like Elisa lamb video yeah, you were taking Polaroids of it. And it was coming out like blurry and you're like you were trying to like. Uh, decipher something about, I don't know. It was very weird.

She seemed like not human,

Victor: like at the ring kind of 

Olivia: thing.

Kind of, yeah.

Victor: So, uh, Zach, what was Olivia wearing?

Zach: I don't remember it wasn't anything outta the ordinary. 

I was pretty distracted by her crazy facial expressions.

Victor: Gotcha. 

Zach: Was this the dream you're gonna do today?

Olivia: Uh, yeah. 

Victor: Was 

this the nightmarish one 

that you had? Oh, okay. It's the other one, because it sounds like Zach had a [00:06:00] nightmare and you had a nightmare recently and you were going back and forth on, do I do the nightmare dream or do I do the dream where apparently you guys existed in the same dream space at the same time? 

Zach: and it's so weird that it was like

a similar feeling and looking location 

Olivia: Yeah I think we have to do both of those

Zach: The first time this happened, the Treehouse,

we both had Treehouse dreams on the same night, but then when, once we described them, they were like pretty different. Weren't 


Olivia: like, yeah, yeah,

Victor: Guys are psychically connected. Your dream, uh, siblings

Olivia: We shared a womb in the dream world.

Zach: That's probably a thing.

Olivia: we should go find our dream mother.

Zach: mom.

Victor: that you need to find each other to be able to find your 

Olivia: dream

Well, we keep finding each other apparently. Yeah. But then the second time this happened, it was that, um, Zach, you still have to tell this dream sometime, cuz it like makes me

Zach: well maybe that's what we should do today is the [00:07:00] tandem. We could do the.

Olivia: Yeah. Let's just talk about tandem dream.

We could do that. Does that work

Victor: tandem dreaming? This is where the podcast shifts into fun. Talks about dreams to like kind of a nightmare sci-fi thing 

where we all end up like in a government camp somewhere that's right. Being experimented on.

Zach: Like, et,

Victor: just like, et I don't, I don't remember et, but like I know of it, but I don't remember what happens in 

Zach: the government kidnapped him cuz he's an alien and the boy has to get him back. But that, yeah, they're gonna wanna dissect our minds after this.

Olivia: Your scene in my dream was so funny.

Zach: Victor scene

Olivia: Yeah. Victor had a scene.

Victor: How many lines did I have?

Olivia: Like a few.

Victor: Okay.

Olivia: you're a great supporting character.

Victor: I wasn't like an

Zach: you're you're like third on the call sheet.

Victor: sheet.

Olivia: That's another like trend I've noticed in my dreams recently is that Victor will like pop up in dreams that he's like, not a part of as just like a support system.

Sometimes like, I'll [00:08:00] call him, I'll be like, Hey, this weird things happening. And he'll be like, I'm sorry. You know, I love you. I'm like, thanks. Like I have to go deal with it.

Victor: We were talking about this last night and I said, I'm her dream Clippy. I just like pop in, like, can I help you with 

anything? No. 


Zach: Yeah, it seems like just like your role in real life

Victor: Yeah.

Zach: a supportive partner. I mean, 

Victor: yeah, no, , 

that's where I should be in her. Psyche is just like, if things get a little distressing, I kind of pop in to help. And then I, I get to fade away. I think that's like the right amount of head space I should be taking 

Olivia: up.

 I think if we were having problems, you would like be a bigger part of my dreams. I tend I tend to dream about my problems 

Victor: No, I, I genuinely like that.

You like in your subconscious I'm filed away as like a helpful like a support 

system. Yeah, I think that's 

Olivia: great.

Zach: [00:09:00] So


Olivia: Yeah. 

Zach: the beginning of 2020, When we worked together, we got into the habit, which is kind of where this like whole idea started cuz we worked relatively early. So I don't know about you. Like my dreams were still fresh.

Olivia: right Yeah 

Zach: I was still kind of that job was a really kind of surreal place in a lot of ways.

And so I, I didn't, I felt like I didn't leave the dream world fully until around noon most days. , so yeah, we got into a routine of like discussing our dreams in the morning. And one day we happened to have ,

we both had to, uh, dream about a Treehouse. We did talk about how this job was on this third floor. Second floor.

Olivia: Yeah.

Zach: And the had a bunch of big windows that looked out at like the canopies of trees. And I feel like that played a


Olivia: it definitely did in mind because my [00:10:00] Treehouse dream, the Treehouse was work. Like we were working from a Treehouse.

 But it was just kind of a weird coincidence that we both dreamed about treehouses on the same 

Zach: yeah. I also, I grew up with a Treehouse, so it was kind of, I remember thinking that mine was like a, um, regression dream, like combining my current situation with, with the past.

Olivia: I don't have a lot of personal experiences with treehouses, but, um, it seemed like a really playful dream. Like it seemed like it seemed like work without, the bullshit that was at work. It was like, as if you and I started our own podcast network, we were podcast producers at this, um, at this job.

And, but it was like, if we were doing it the way we wanted to, and it was a much more fun environment and we were literally in a Treehouse, which was dope.

Zach: Yeah. Yeah. Mine was had a playful atmosphere too, but I Think

\ I was made to feel like a child a lot at that job by our boss. So I think [00:11:00] the dream had this tone for me of like, well, if I'm gonna be treated like a child, I'm gonna act like one and have fun.

Olivia: Right. Yeah. It was definitely a, an environment where like, they were very critical of us in ways that like didn't always make sense and like kind of micromanaging, but there wasn't a lot of consistency in it. , you didn't always know what was expected of you, but you knew that there was a lot expected of you.

So it was, yeah, it was, it could be stressful at times.

Victor: The, uh, dream Bible entry seems relevant here, um, to dream of a Treehouse, represents your wish for privacy and independence, wanting to do whatever you want without other people noticing it or criticizing you 

a sign,

Zach: relevant pretty relevant, 

Victor: A sign that you wanna escape from waking life problems or enjoy yourself alone, wanting privacy or alone time. So like, that's how you guys were feeling that that job was you enjoyed working together. You enjoyed the work you were doing. It felt like there were people kind of breathing down your neck sometimes, or like being overly critical. [00:12:00] So that's great. You had a shared desire for the job to be more like that.

Treehouse fantasy.

Olivia: Yeah. That's interesting.

Zach: could have been an alternate title for this podcast, Youngs Treehouse or something.

Olivia: we thought about

Zach: It sounds like a high brow kids show Youngs Treehouse it's on PBS.

Olivia: so that's kind of where this all started, right? 

Zach: Yeah. And since then you keep

having my dreams

Olivia: after you've 

Zach: yeah, they're not usually the same night except last night. Apparently.

Olivia: Well, and we don't always know though, cuz we 

don't true We don't share our dreams every day. So who's to say, 

Zach: So, yeah. Do you wanna tell us about

your epic tale last.

Olivia: I was like performing at a shadow puppet theater, for like a large audience, a school audience. And I remember seeing my cousin in the audience,

 It felt kind of like a school assembly or like a. talent show or something. Cut to like in the hallways. [00:13:00] And, I saw Zach there and, um, Zach, you were showing me this envelope and, um, it had a name on it and it was like addressed to the science teacher. And you were like, look what I found. And I opened it and it was like, somebody had tried to send the science teacher a, a COVID mask that was like poisoned with arsenic. They were trying to kill him.

Zach: Rude.

Olivia: yeah, also, , this was a high school, but explicitly this was, this was made clear several times. You and I were adults auditing high school classes.

Zach: Okay.

Olivia: for fun. 

Zach: Like we weren't even asked to be there.

Olivia: there? No, it was like we got something out of these classes.

We're standing there and my cousin who I saw in the audience, like came up to me and she lives out of town. And I was like, Hey Zack, this is my cousin, cousin.

This is my buddy, Zach and Zach, you look her like [00:14:00] dead in the eyes, like just like dead pan. You were like, wanna hook up. I don't

Zach: It's not usually my strategy

Olivia: strategy. Yeah.


I know we were, and then me and her were like, like taken aback and you were like, I don't know, just thought I'd 

Zach: thought just float that out there.

Olivia: Um, okay. So I walked in my car and I'm like leaving to go home and, um, my car was broken into, someone had rifled through my glove box. I don't know. That was, that's a thing that happened to my car a lot when I was living in like downtown Seattle when I was going to school, like, I kind of just like brushed it off and I got in the car and then Victor, you were there with me and we were driving home on the freeway and I kind of got lucid at this point something that will happen to me is I will get lucid when I'm doing a thing that I know is gonna take a long time, like eating at a restaurant or waiting for something.

[00:15:00] Um, I, that will sometimes make me lucid because it's like, it feels like the dream is gonna fizzle out. And so I'll like try and become aware. I don't know. Um,

Victor: so your ADHD superpower kicks in yeah. Being bored in your own dream and waking yourself up.

Olivia: Yeah, exactly. And so when I become lucid, I will often fly. Um, but you were there with me and we were in my car and I like said to you, this is gonna take a while for us to drive home.

Um, look so like, since this is a dream. Do you wanna fly? Like I can, I know I can fly. Do you wanna come with me? Like it's okay. We can leave the car. It'll just drive. It'll keep driving. And you were like, sure, I'll try. I was like, okay. But like, you have to come with me. And, , you were like, okay, I think I can do it.

So when I'm gonna fly in a dream, I'll kind of like launch myself up. It's like a, an energy momentum coming from my core, just like shoots

Zach: Yeah, like Superman. Yeah.

Olivia: bad. [00:16:00] Yes. And I'm sitting here in the car and I'm like going to like propel myself through the car roof, like at, to fly home. And I'm insistent that you're gonna come with me and I go, I like bundle up that energy and I go and nothing happens.

And I realize that like,

 I can't fly with you here. So , that was that

Victor: So not only can I not fly in my dreams, I prevent you from flying in your dreams.

Olivia: Exactly. 

Zach: He keeps you grounded.

Olivia: quite literally, um, and then I was at school again with you, Zach. And, we were investigating this like arsenic COVID mask situation, and there was like a name on this envelope. Like we knew that it was coming from a fake name and this is where it got like really surreal.

And it was just the two of us were sitting in this white classroom, [00:17:00] like fluorescent lighting. And, , it was like, we were watching a video of the woman who was trying to poison the science teacher. But I was also maybe in the video and the video was not really on a screen anywhere. It was just like, all around. And we were taking Polaroids of it, trying to like, get information of her and it would like, it would print it out. And there would be like little hints of other information in the Polaroid that weren't in the video that you could see.

Zach: I like the idea that there's video of the events and we're like, oh, evidence Polaroid

Olivia: It was honestly, so we were talking about ARGs last week and it was kind of like that where like we were, what does that stand for again?

Zach: um, alternate reality game.

Olivia: right? Okay. So it's like.

It's a video but there's other work you have to do to get what you are looking for out of it.

Like, you can't just watch it. Sometimes there's like a phone number or [00:18:00] social media

Zach: Yeah. Or you'll have to run the audio through a spectrogram or something.

Olivia: Exactly. And that's kind of, I think that's where that came from. We had to take pictures of the video to, get this extra information out of it.

We're trying to like solve this mystery.

Zach: that is creepy the media of, of media. Like a lot of those ERGs have like, somebody will film a TV with their phone

there's that like low Bootle quality to it. That's like kind of eerie.

Olivia: Yes. And that was pretty much the whole thing. Um, sorry. Yeah, that's what I meant by like, it's just kind of an epic tale. That's like, I don't know if we can even really get into it.

There's like a whole lot going on, but, that's the overview for you

Zach: yeah. It didn't seem like there was,

I mean

Too much going on,

I always find it interesting when dreams pick up a thread instead of abandoning them, like you came back to the same, 

the arsenic situation.

Olivia: right?

Yeah. That was actually, [00:19:00] that was an important thing throughout the whole dream. I think the only part that felt this connected was when I was driving home with Victor. also you kept complimenting my, taste in bridges.

Zach: How do we know? You don't remember anything from your dreams last night, Victor?

Victor: No,

just a classroom where you both were there. Not acknowledging me at all.

Zach: I think that might have been you for real. Just the attitude of like.

I don't know if I can fly, but I'm totally willing to try

Victor: that 


Zach: feels very Victor.

Victor: So I pulled, I haven't gotten a chance to read these yet, but I, I pulled a few keywords out of your dream. Um, so I couldn't find shadow puppets, but I've got shadows, puppets and puppeteer.

Olivia: I was a puppeteer 

Victor: so real quick, um, to dream of a puppeteer represents a controlling [00:20:00] or manipulative behavior. It may also reflect manipulative intentions or awareness of someone else trying to manipulate you.

Olivia: Okay.

Zach: You 

were expressing, you were expressing your interest in creating in our ag.

Olivia: Yeah, I was

Victor: very manipulative to the audience. Um, we can get into shadows and puppets in a bit, but I also pulled up poison.

Olivia: I would also say school 

Zach: Yeah That's 

Olivia: is probably the biggest thing.

Zach: that's relevant to

both of our dreams 

Victor: high school. I pulled up high school. To dream of being in high school, represents anxiety or concerns you have in regards to gaining power, resources or status, how well you are being perceived by others or how well you are performing in life. You may want more responsibility status, or to feel more capable. You are trying to improve yourself in some manner.

Negatively high school may reflect too much concern with [00:21:00] developing power or status high school points to insecurities or anxieties about how powerful or capable you feel as a person to dream of not completing or dropping out of high school may reflect feelings about not having done enough to achieve power or status feelings that you didn't try hard enough to achieve your goals, , feelings that you've surrendered or given up on an accomplishment. You cared a lot about. Feeling like a loser for not having tried hard enough. It's something important to you. Attending specific classes in a school may represent the manner in which you are thinking. For example, history classes may re reflect the reexamining of your past and math classes, your attempt to solve a difficult problem.

Olivia: so Zach, it was like, we were going back to a high school willingly to attend classes, um, for enrichment purposes. But we were going specifically for art classes,

Zach: Hmm.

Olivia: which is like funny, cuz we both went [00:22:00] to art school in college, 

Zach: Yeah, 

Olivia: yeah like felt like we needed something out of like paper mache, high school art.

Zach: Yeah.

I have dreams all the time when I'm back at high school or college and it's always the classic. Like I have the, um, what do you call it? Your list of classes that you have to get to, but they're all in different buildings. And it's like my first day, and I don't know which building.

It's just, it's just reliving an actual day.

That's the, your first day of college or high school. 

Olivia: Yeah.

Victor: So, I don't, I have no . Idea if there's a connection here, but something I thought about with high school and maybe why Zach is in your dream or like a, a heavy theme is you've your, uh, pretty far into an interview process with a new 



right So if high school's connected to, um, you know, power status, accomplishments, things like that. And you're like, kind of in a pending waiting place with this new job opportunity, which Zach is [00:23:00] also looking into. So he is kind of in it with 

you mm-hmm and you've been talking about like, oh, maybe we'll end up working together again.

Maybe it'll ,be like a little reunion for our last job. So possibly high school together with Zach. Is this thought of like maybe working together again?

Olivia: Yeah. Yeah. It did feel like Zach, you were like my one friend there.

Zach: Well, yeah, all the other kids.

were kids.

Olivia: Yeah. No, it was like, yes. Yeah. It was like, you were the only person I was gonna hang out with there.

Zach: And who's the creepy

woman poisoning

Olivia: Yeah. Janet something. But that was a pseudonym. It was not her real name.

Zach: Janet, the demon.

Victor: and art classes. Right. You guys are kind of in artistic profession. 


Olivia: So,

yeah. Yeah. That is interest<affirmative>.

Zach: Yeah. Cause I apparently was in the same high school last night, but all I remember is the tail end, which was super creepy and disturbing.

Olivia: Yeah. I can't wait to get into that.

Zach: I mean we kind of already did,

Victor: That's all you remember from the dream is just the scene [00:24:00] with Olivia.

Zach: Yeah. That's all, I, it was just last night and that it woke me up in the middle of the night,

well, I woke myself up trying to replicate her. Uh, well, if this is about us pursuing the same job and I'm imitating Olivia,

Victor: Oh, there you go.

Olivia: That's funny.

Zach: I don't know why it would manifest as something like

thing, like creepy, other than the only thing I can think of is that I might be kind of

stressed about like it not handing out or something.

Olivia: This is kind of a weird analogy, but, so our dog, Casper, he is a trauma boy and,, he came here.

 On a truck with his litter mate ghost. And they both were adopted out. We recently got in contact with ghosts owner and took the dogs to meet each other, and when Casper saw ghost, he like had a full blown meltdown.

 He wasn't like scared of ghost, but recognizing the dog that he went through a traumatic [00:25:00] situation with freaked him out. So like maybe even though you and I are, buddies who came here together, uh the like. Connection. You have to working with me is also connected to like an anxiety inducing work environment,

Zach: Yeah, like fear. It might turn out



Victor: again, like, I'm just, this is all just shots in the dark. But so if you've got this, uh, a big component of the dream was like, there's someone that's not trustworthy.

That's trying to poison someone here. And you guys are working together to try and suss out like who this, who the untrustworthy person is, who the, who, who, where the danger is in this situation. 


Zach: poisoning especially poisoning something like a mask, which is supposed to protect you. It's like a super devious underhanded, you know, kinda

like the people.

We used and you've worked for twice now.

those who you can't tell right away might be trouble.

Olivia: [00:26:00] That. Okay. I just remember to detail too. And it was that we talked to the science teacher and he was like, yeah, I got a notification from the administration, like from the school that was like, oh, your new PPE equipment, like your new PPE gear is here.

So like the school got it from this, like other entity. And it like, they were ready to just hand it off to him. it got all the way to him. And he was the one who had to realize that like, like the school wasn't even gonna protect him from that.

Zach: Yeah, that seems significant. 

Victor: So then if we look at poison. To dream of poison represents situations, patterns, or people that contaminate our sense of self emotional toxicity from interacting with people or situations that are incompatible with you, any type of exposure to energy that is antithetical to your own, or violates your principles, feelings about your life or relationships being intentionally contaminated by [00:27:00] others, real life situations that may encourage a dream with poison may be time spent with warped family members or when introverts are forced to socialize with extroverts.

So that does kind of connect to the idea of maybe like a toxic or incompatible person, like a, like a personality trait or, or like toxic behaviors that you're maybe concerned about on some level

Zach: Or experiencing in the workplace.

there's also something in there about compromising your values or, or

Victor: Yes. Yeah.

Zach: that was you. You used that run a show.

that was very, very antithetical to your values. That's what it said.

Olivia: Yes. Yeah. And I was basically told to suck it up. I've gone through several jobs since then, where like I can tell right away when somebody wants to exploit me and , and doesn't value my work 

um, because I've run into it a few times now it's like become really apparent. There's like real clear red flags right off the bat. Um, [00:28:00] and this latest job opportunity has not displayed those red flags, maybe this is just because I'm like, traumatized , but like that in and of itself sometimes can feel like a red flag, you know?

 I'm waiting for it to turn sour. what's the catch? 

Victor: You're jaded.

Zach: That's what that plays into why I couldn't tell if you were laughing or crying.

And then I was trying to imitate it, you know, much like I'm like trying to imitate the, the pro uh, this process of like, Applying to this job, but also I was trying to show you what you looked like so that you would know you're 

sending mixed messages.

Victor: Yeah. So, so if we run with, I don't know if this is resonating with you guys, but if you run with the idea of high school as being representative of your careers or your career goals, it's like, well, you were doing this together in the past. Now you're coming back at it together to give it [00:29:00] another shot.

And then you feel like you have to investigate like the risks there.

Zach: it is, it is post high school and we're not like we don't have the naivete of like a freshman

who doesn't might be totally unaware of the anic.

Olivia: Yeah. Yeah. That's right. And like, we were not the target of the poison, like it was the science teacher also, it was my science teacher from high school.

Um, but, uh, we were investigating for him.

Why wouldn't it be us? That was the target, you know,

Zach: because we don't have that job yet.

You know, we're investigating on behalf of the current faculty.

And I don't know if you had like a, like certain notions or his history with this teacher, but science does seem related to like, to poison.

Olivia: Well, I, I do, but also, like is the, is the school itself, the job, 

Zach: this auditing thing seems like it is right.

Victor: [00:30:00] it seemed like high school represented like life goals and aspirations specifically, like, um, like, you know, like career goals or 

Olivia: material 


Okay Gotcha. So like the auditing of the classes is like the job application process. Like we're not hired yet. 

Zach: I wish I could remember everything that happened before the end of my dream to see if it lines up with,

cuz we both ended in like a, a eerie, uncertain place.

Olivia: It was very surreal to like, Yeah. and this like evil person felt like It was like a dark entity kind of threatening thing. 

Victor: Okay. I pulled up a few things based on what we're talking about. There's I pulled up teachers science and then classrooms.

I feel like classrooms is maybe a good place to start. Um, to dream of classrooms represents an interest in learning about yourself, personal growth or finding solutions to problems or questions. You may have a [00:31:00] concern about a specific subject or issue the subject of a classroom represents, the manner method or direction you are thinking. So I think we've got two separate concepts here. Right? We've got the art class, which is the reason you're here. And then we, then we've got the science class with the science teacher, which is the focus of the anxiety.

Right. Mm-hmm, , that's where the trouble is happening is with the science class. Um, which could, I mean, just, just talking off top of my head, right. Is like art would represent like what you wanna be doing. Just like focusing on making like cool podcasts or whatever. And then science might be like more analytical.

Right. And it

Olivia: And this job is literally like a tech podcast. Like it's a company that produces podcasts for like, tech companies and like corporate clients.


Victor: so maybe there's an anxiety about maybe how those things are supposed to synthesize

Olivia: I have a little bit of an anxiety about being out of my element a little [00:32:00] bit or like producing Content about things that I don't know anything about they produce a lot of podcasts for like security companies. I'm like, I know absolutely nothing about that. Um, and that's I mean that's just like a fear of the unknown thing

Victor: So, so that could be the, the meaning there with the, dichotomy between science and art. Right. Mm-hmm and then also like not to, not to like force the metaphor, but to keep going on the train.

I, I, I was on earlier, I guess something I was thinking was like, maybe science would be connected to this, um, feeling of having to be analytical or not your whole self or, or guarded or reserved in like a new workplace, having to like, you know, read people in a way that you're, that's not as free and artistic as the actual work you wanna be doing. 

Zach: Yeah, I don't know about you, but that was my,

those were my binary subjects. Art. I graduated [00:33:00] high school with like six art credits straight A's and like three science credits straight C's.

Olivia: I did Okay In science I did. terribly in math though and I do feel like There's a relationship there

Zach: Yeah, I was weirdly, I was good at math cuz it was right or wrong. Science had more critical thinking that I couldn't wrap my brain around.

Olivia: So here's an interesting note the science teacher in my dream was my science teacher from high school.

I actually really did like this teacher, like once I got to know him and like, or once he got to know me, um, and was invested in me as a student, but like my very first experience with this teacher stuck with me throughout my entire education and in a negative way I've always struggled with math, particularly like math related anxiety.

Um, I just like, it's a thing I just. Have always felt like I was bad at math and I internalized that. And so [00:34:00] I would continually get behind in math. And then when I went to this school I was new at the school And I placed in a math class, like lower than most people in my grade. And when I went to that math class on the first day of school.

This teacher was like, okay, so everyone knows this thing. Right? You remember this obviously, and I did not know it, uh, because I don't know math. And I just like, you know, it was not a thing I was good at. Um, so I didn't know this like basic thing that I should have known. And she must have told this science teacher that, because then I went to my chemistry class and this science teacher in front of everybody Was like so, um, Mrs. So, and so tells me that some of you don't know this really basic thing. Um, and if you don't know that that's a big problem and you should really get your shit together. And the, [00:35:00] the sticking point was that I was the only person in this chemistry class, cuz like this was 10th grade. I was the only person in 10th grade who was in that teacher, that math teacher's class.

And everyone knew that because I wasn't in their math class so it was like, everyone knew that, that he was talking about me. Uh, so like that's a thing about that 

teacher from this dream 

Zach: That does that reminds me of when our old boss, uh, seem to think, you didn't know how a computer works.

Olivia: Oh 

Zach: Like it's a similar kind of


Olivia: Well, 

no I mean, yes, but like 

Victor: but you did know how 

Olivia: kind I did know how I do know how

Zach: but she was remember when she would talk shit about us on during her shows,

like announcing to everybody that, that the producers are incompetent.

Olivia: Yeah 


Zach: But yeah, that we weren't actually, she was, but she, it was similar shaming, public

Olivia: it is, it is [00:36:00] similar in that sense, but like, I would say the feeling was very different. Like, I didn't feel 

shame from that situation because 

it's a false it. Yeah. It was just like, wow, that's really stupid of you. Um, but I felt deeply ashamed that I didn't know this like algebra formula, because I was told I was stupid for not knowing it, you know?

and I didn't know it and I didn't feel like I could learn it so, 

Zach: Trying to connect that 

to the science teacher being the target of the poisoning. Do you have,

Olivia: Well, we talked about science being the source of like anxiety and fear right Or like unknown 

Victor: So I was just gonna get into the science entry in the dream Bible. All I do is read the dream Bible and I love it. Um, so the science entry is, um, to dream of studying science, represents thoughts or situations in your life that are experimental new ideas, new habits, or new methods of dealing with problems you are learning from these new experiences or methods. Does that feel like that connects or do [00:37:00] you think maybe science symbolizes something different in the stream?

Olivia: Science is the new job the new idea the new habits the new experience we are trying to figure out who is the threat 

to the new experience 

Victor: I think there's a lot of, there's a lot of layers involved with science as a subject here in this stream, cuz you've got it by itself, but you've also got the relationship with the science teacher. Right. And then you've got the, uh, juxtaposition between science and art classes. Right. So science could, could, its relevance could be embedded in any of those

Olivia: Totally Could we actually like do a quick deep dive into Zach's dream since Zach's dream is like really concise

Zach: From this conversation, I feel like I figured mine out and kind decided already. Right. That I, I feel like I'm

Victor: Yeah, let's get that again [00:38:00] though. Let's kinda go through it and yeah,

Zach: cause when I woke up in the middle of the night from the nightmare, I was like, what the fuck was that? Like, I had no idea what that, why I would dream that, but now I'm feeling like it's it's uh, cause I was literally thinking about that job opportunity last night and like, I hope that works out. That would be cool.


so I figure, I feel like it has to do with me following your lead on it and also being a little anxious about what not knowing if it's gonna be something that either of us are gonna,

Olivia: laugh or cry about yeah exactly 

Zach: Being the 

like sort of

art department within this technological


Olivia: mm-hmm 

Zach: Whether or not our skills are actually going to, thrive there. 

 Or even whether or not yeah, we're gonna get that, get the job.

It seems that, I mean, obviously you're a lot closer than I am. 

So I think, I think my dream was just, yeah, anxiety, but that, um, [00:39:00] cuz I, I feel like the last few of my dreams have been about

where I'm at professionally

Olivia: Mm-hmm 

Zach: I'm doing podcast. Like half the time and the other half the time I'm still working in industry that I'm trying to get out of, which is cooking.

so I have this constant,

Dissatisfaction, like, like a musical note that needs to be resolved where I wanna just like fully cross the threshold into podcasting full time.

Olivia: mm-hmm 

Zach: and I feel like a lot of my dreams last night's included are about that.

 So like mimicking you makes sense being like unsure what and freaked, unsure, and freaked out by what you're going through.



Olivia: yeah that does make sense 

Zach: Also real quick. Wanna say that the being able to freak somebody out with a facial expression is a reoccurring theme in my dream, since childhood,

Olivia: Oh, 

Zach: the earliest I remember being, I was the one I remember I was at a zoo or an aquarium and I was freaking out adults. Like I would walk up to and make a face and they would get like

feverishly terrified and run [00:40:00] away.

Olivia: I wonder if there's something about that 

Zach: I, And I, I, would go to, like, I remember going, walking up to like an aquarium. There was a school of fish and I made the face and they all scattered. And then this, this dream actually had a punchline. I went into a, a public restroom and looked in the mirror and I was a redhead.

And I was like, that was that's it that's all it takes to. But I also

Olivia: I feel like you've told me this before. You're like, you're saying anytime I look in, in the mirror and dream I'm like a chubby 

Zach: anytime since then Yeah And that's, that's how I know I'm dreaming. Sense that dream. But I also, also, I knew looking in the mirror that I wasn't actively making the face yet, and I was scared to make the face. Cause I thought I would like drive myself insane. It wa it had the, the tone of like, um, at slumber parties standing in front of the mirror and being too scared to say candy man, three times. 

Victor: So, um, so have you seen the face that you make or it's this knowledge that if you were to make that face in the mirror, [00:41:00] you would break your own brain in like a love crafty in fashion?

Zach: the second one so that I haven't seen it, but then 

Victor: The face that can't be seen, that's

Zach: but then last night stream, I had the feeling that, that the feeling that Olivia's face was giving me was I connected it to that feeling that I was able to give people in the past.

Olivia: That's 

like a trope where it's like you can't show it or it loses its power, you know,

Victor: Yeah. It's a big thing in horror. The idea of the thing is scarier than the thing itself. And you can never represent, like, you can never create the scary thing.

Yeah. You can allude to it. And then people's imaginations

Olivia: It's like if you ever seen a horror movie where like, it's scary up until you have seen too much, like, they show you the monster and you're like, oh my God, it's a guy in latex. 

Victor: Like, I love alien. But when a, when it's like the guy doing the crab walk backwards in the alien suit, that's where they 

Zach: yeah Yeah.

Olivia: It's weird that you're like a consistently [00:42:00] different person in the mirror.

Zach: Yeah. 

Olivia: Is that your like dream alter ego?

Zach: No that, cause I know it's not me. And that's how I become lucid.

Olivia: oh, okay.

Victor: Hmm maybe that's the real you and this you is just an illusion.

Zach: Yeah. I think 

Olivia: does dream Bible say about red

Zach: I think it's just my like, yeah. What do you call it when you lucid dreaming a totem? It's just the idea that this, like my brain is filling in. Like, what do you not look like? and it was like a chubby redhead. One time. It was a black woman, which is arguably further from who, what I actually look like. 

Victor: Would

Zach: And I was hot too. I remember in that dream, I was like, damn, I'm a Fox


Hotter as a black than a red than a chubby red hat kid.

Victor: when you're a redhead, is it like blood red or is it like your conventional, like orange haired, redhead,

Zach: NA natural red. Yeah. Yeah.

But [00:43:00] bright, bright, red and freckles.

Victor: So orange hair in a dream represents a thinking style that is noticeable or hard to avoid noticing beliefs, emotions, or situations that are impossible to stop or avoid an area of your life that is overpowering your focus.

And can't go unnoticed. Negatively orange hair may reflect a preoccupation with wanting to be noticed or outrageous behavior that is impossible to ignore extremist thinking that shocks other people.

Olivia: That actually makes sense that it's just like. A noticeable difference, you know? Cause like if I were to look in the mirror and I had the same like colored hair, but like I didn't quite look like me. I don't know if I'd think much of it, but if I had like a very striking difference yeah. That, that might make me lucid.


Yeah, cause it's not just the hair. It's my whole facial structure too.

Olivia: hair Yeah. 


Zach: Kinda look like the, uh, kid from sand.

Olivia: cool. I kind of feel like we [00:44:00] got to the bottom of our dream.

Zach: yeah.

Olivia: That's funny that it seems like our dreams were not only like thematically similar, but also about the same thing.

Zach: And in a similar place, 

Olivia: Mm-hmm 

Zach: I really want the dream. I really want the dream plane to be real, like the idea that you actually like Astro project to a different world.

Olivia: I find that very 

Victor: And then, I mean, there's the idea that there's this shared symbolism, right? Mm-hmm so it's like, you guys are dreaming about the same thing, cuz it's on both of your minds, cuz you're going through kind of a shared experience and your brain subconsciously have a shared language of symbolism mm-hmm to represent those things, which results in having a shared dream.

Same as the Treehouse. Yeah. The Treehouse subconsciously represents something that is shared between the two of you. And so you have an overlapping dream because you're thinking about the same 

Olivia: thing. 

Zach: mm-hmm

Olivia: That's really [00:45:00] interesting. I what blows me away every time is just how on point this shared symbolism is like, like last week the duck, you know, 

like that that, 

is bizarre and like, so insanely on point and it's like, why, why does duck mean that 


me? Right.

I don't get it,

Zach: yeah. Yes. The like The cultural unconscious.

Olivia: Yeah,

Zach: Oh speaking of of Yi in terms, um, I was gonna say right up top the shadow puppet thing that, that just, uh,

just using the word shadow automat made me think of just the idea of the unconscious.

Victor: Yeah, we didn't get into the shadow puppets.


was a redhead. Oh my God.

Victor: oh, really?

Olivia: wait. Okay. So,


Zach: make you realize

Olivia: well, okay, so I remember during the shadow puppet thing, I was filling in for somebody else. And, um, I [00:46:00] walked out onto the stage, like to go back behind the stage to do the shadow puppet thing, but like, I had like bright red curly hair and everyone recognized me. And then I remember like looking at myself from behind the stage, um shift just shifting perspectives. So like I saw myself on the stage walking to the back of the stage. Um, yeah, I was a redhead.

Victor: So it seems like being a redhead in your dream for both of you is maybe a way of highlighting that you are not yourself in your dream, that you 

Zach: like a third person perspective,

Victor: Yeah. You're both seeing like, oh, it's really not me, cuz I'm not a redhead.

Zach: know, it would be creepy.

as if like, remember that Reddit dream we did, where the person went through the window into an alternate. They kept going into like liminal versions of, and they would see like alternate versions of their family. What if Olivia and I [00:47:00] start seeing redhead versions of each other around town,

Olivia: fuck.

Zach: that would be a great premise for 

Olivia: that would horror movie.

That would be, I'm actually remembering, um, like just briefly, like thinking about other, cause I will often have dreams where I'm not myself and I'm looking at myself third, like from a third person perspective. And I, I did have one, a few months ago where that was also a very in depth, like several characters.

I was playing several characters, but one of the characters I was playing who was a female was, uh, redheaded. And then the other character that I was was, um, was male. And that was like, that was a distinctive enough difference, you know? But, um, when I was a, when I was a woman, I had red hair.

Victor: That's very

Zach: So, yeah, we did talk about the puppets a little bit and I, yeah, I just wanted to add the like shadow to me just like is a little hat on a hat, you know, like indicating [00:48:00] that this is taking place in your subconscious.

Olivia: Yeah,

Victor: Yeah,

So I think we've figured out that in the astrol plane, you two are a pair of redheaded twins. Mm-hmm and then I don't remember my dreams because I'm basically Janet from the good place and I just pop into people's dreams. Like, can I help you with something? And then I 

Zach: We sh we should, uh, we should all do DMT together. See if we can get, get to the Astro plane outside of a dream.

Olivia: I would be down.

Victor: Yeah. Sounds like good

Zach: I dunno if they make a great podcast, the 

Victor: least it won't last very long.

Zach: Yeah. It's just 10 minutes of us going. Oh, uh,

Olivia: I think people would listen to 

Zach: I think they have listened to that. I think it might be the most popular podcast on the, on the market.

Olivia: [00:49:00] At this ad 


it's like a de choking Like if somebody's choking, you like stick this in their mouth and it like pulls the hot dog out of their throat. But look at this fucking ad

Victor: Yeah.

Why does candle?

Is he in 

Olivia: was safe Well, cuz that's he can look at candles cuz he is not dead.

Victor: Is he mourning a different kid that died choking on hot dogs.

Zach: I just put in my earbuds and heard he can look at candles because he's not dead. 

Victor: I'm gonna 

Olivia: send it to you. 

So. And this ad just popped up. It's like for a de choking tool for kids.

Zach: de choking.

Olivia: Yeah If you're choking, you shove this thing down their throat and you suck the hot dog out of their esophagus. 

Victor: Yeah.

It's like a plastic [00:50:00] pipe with a pump that you like, if someone's choking, you shove it down their throat and then you can pump out whatever's stuck in their throat.

Olivia: But this ad just made me laugh cuz it has pictures of this thing with like some nasty chew up hotdog shit in it.

And then this little kid standing next to it, like holding a candle and smiling down at this candle and it just says another life saved.

Zach: Oh, it is called the de choker. I thought you just made that word up. 

Victor: But it seems like a vigil thing to

Zach: Yeah, he he's mourning his sister that didn't have this product.

Victor: Yeah, like he gets to live, but so many children have died from choking on hot dogs before

Olivia: He he 

also looks really happy. I think he wanted to be an only 

Zach: It looks like 

a it looks like a gross improvised bong.

Olivia: oh God.

It also kind of looks like a, like one of those like vacuum, like sex toys.

Zach: Oh, [00:51:00] yeah.

Olivia: Speaking of,


Zach: toys 

Olivia: toys 

Zach: What a segue? 

Olivia: Uh yeah. Zach, you wanna

Zach: yeah 

Olivia: kick it off?

Zach: Yeah. On the,

uh, uh, adjacent topic of tandem. Not, not tandem dreaming, but like, cause that last one was, we were like in the same place at the same time, this is more like influence streaming.

Olivia: mm-hmm . 

Zach: Um I'm an influencer. I need to be getting some ad revenue on my dreams. Yeah. So I had a dream a while ago when we were still working together. remember it took place on a highway, like access road.

So there was the main highway that, um, looked a lot like, uh, certain corridors of I five,

Like it definitely felt like it took place in Washington.

There were a lot of like tall ass pine trees on either side of the highway.

And then I took an exit [00:52:00] onto an accessed road, like uh, uh, dirt road,

closer to the trees. And there was like essentially like a wait station for trucks. And there were a ton of, um, like 18 wheelers, big rigs down there

And I was tasked with uh, unloading one of them, it was like full of cardboard boxes.

Like you might see in a U-Haul

and I had to, unload them all, or maybe I was loading. I don't remember if I was taking 'em off or putting 'em on, but it just, it seemed like a lot of work for one person. And at one point I noticed on the ground in the dirt was one of those, uh, floppy, rubber butts that, that you can buy

for practice

at, uh, sex, sex stores.

Victor: So we've all got 

'em right 

Zach: we've I'm 

acting like no one knows what I'm talking about, but you know, just look under your bed. Uh yes I've never, I've only seen 'em on the shelves at sex stores. They're [00:53:00] like $400,

Olivia: Oh, my 

Victor: My God,

I've seen them like mounted on the wall, like looming over everything, usually above a doorway 

for some 

reason Insect shops. Yeah.

Zach: For some reason I meant, I thought you meant like, just at like a friend's house, they're like hanging it like a trophy.

Victor: I mean, that's what I would do with mine. If I got one.

Yeah go put it right above the mantle.

Zach: funny to put it on a plaque, like you hunted a human.

Um, but yeah, and it is, if you don't know what we're talking about is just a butt. It's just the rubber butt with the two holes that are near each other. 


Olivia: it's not just a, but,

Zach: right 

Well I think I assume in the dream, it, it was, yeah, the female anatomy, the female from form, from the waist to the mid thigh,

Olivia: gotcha.

Zach: Um,

in life size and made of, uh, whatever they make sex toys out of that jiggle like human parts.

I'm painting a vivid picture, cuz it adds to the humor of what's about to happen, [00:54:00] which is that I

knew it wasn't mine.

I assume it fell outta one of the boxes or something. Uh, but I didn't want, I didn't know any of these people, that was an important feeling in the dream was, I didn't know why I was tasked with doing this.

I'm not a trucker.

I don't, I don't know why any of this is happening, but like, I don't wanna let anyone down. So I'm gonna try to do this job. Oh shit. There's a rubber butt on the floor. I don't want them to think I brought that or I don't want, I don't want, uh, if it did come outta the box, I don't wanna violate any, like clients', you know, uh,

privacy or , you know, when you hear ads for Adam and Eve, they always say like ships, discreetly, and discreet packaging or whatever.

And I'm totally betraying that right now. So I felt like I had to get the, uh, the rubber butt into the cab of the truck for some reason that felt safer than the back of the truck. And I didn't, I didn't have keys to it, but the window was open. [00:55:00] And at this point, I, I, I'm walking around the side of the truck with the butt and I'm trying to like hide it from the,

the highway, the actual highway where cars are going by.

So I'm like shuffling along the side of the truck with the butt to my chest. And then by the time I get to the cab, it's like impossibly high. Like the open window is like, I don't know, 15 feet in the air.

Uh, and there's no LA there's no ladder to get to the door. So I just like Chuck it, trying to hit the window, but I overshoot and it goes to the other side of the cab and like bounces in the dirt and like flops the kinetic energy off.

And then I walk around and I try again and I do the same thing and it just keeps happening. I just can't sometimes it'll like splat against the side of the door and like peel off and fall back down and sometimes it overshoots. Um, but I just can't seem to get it into the truck.

uh, and the whole time, I'm just, I'm, I'm like, it's [00:56:00] super urgent.

I'm trying to get this thing away before anybody sees and, and I can't

Olivia: I love it.

Zach: and as I'm describing it, I'm realizing it's like,

there's some overlapping themes with my dream from last week, besides lobbyist atory ones, but also the like

being exposed.

Olivia: mm-hmm

Victor: yeah. There's like shame tied in with a task you can't accomplish.

Zach: Right. 

Olivia: Right. Mm-hmm

Zach: There's just more components to it, more visual components this time. So, but yeah, what you want to go ahead and fill in part two.

Olivia: Yeah. So, um,

This was in 2020, right. And Zach told me this dream. Um, and I think you sent it to me in like a voice memo, and I thought it was very funny. And then the following night, I had a dream where [00:57:00] I was at the truck stop and, um, from kind of like across a street, uh, and kind of hiding in a Bush. I was watching Zach.

Throw this rubber butt over the truck and bouncing it off the window. And just, um, kind of like looking over his shoulder paranoid and not knowing that there was anyone there watching. And I sensed that he wouldn't want to be seen doing this. And so I was hiding. So, uh, I inserted myself into your dream

Zach: just like but it was like, beat for beat the same dream. Right. Just from a different perspective.

Olivia: I was the person you were worried about you.

Zach: and I tried to describe it in great detail. So we could compare notes where you did the like forest I five description.

Olivia: Yeah.

 [00:58:00] At the time. I think you told me, like, I knew it was like a wait station, it was either like Dawn or dusk, like it was, um, kind of dark, like, but not middle of the night.


Zach: yeah, my dream. It was a typical like foggy Seattle. I didn't have a sense for time. I knew it was day. It wasn't night.

Olivia: Okay.

Zach: and it could have been early or late afternoon. I don't know. It was, it was over, it was overcast.

Victor: Interesting. So overcast kind of midday for Zach and then clear skies like sunrise, sunset ish, timing for Olivia.

Olivia: It was before sunrise or after sunset. It was 


Victor: but in the lead up to one of those things, or like, 

Olivia: yeah it was like the 

sun was not up, but it was not like the middle of the night.

Zach: Gotcha. And I figured even if I didn't describe the trees and every, in I five to you, since all your dreams take place in Washington, it would just look like that by default.

Olivia: I've lived here my whole life [00:59:00] in Washington and so I've like taken, I've gone to like rest areas and like, so I think I just kind of like filled in the details with one of those. 

Zach: Yeah. I mean, we were working at our job at the time and I was coming from south Seattle. So to me it felt like this one stretch of I five between Seattle and Mount lake terrace.

Victor: What did the truck look like?

Olivia: It was a it was a, like a white semi truck.

Victor: Okay. Okay. 

Zach: the 

Victor: Zach, was it white and your dream?

Zach: the box car. If that's what they call, it was the, the freight part where, where everything goes. 

That part was white. 

Olivia: I don't know what color the cab was. Actually. I know the box was white 

Victor: though.

Okay. Box is white in both your dreams.

Zach: remember the cab being, um, a shiny metallic color, like maybe like maroon the standout part of the truck was the size, the like height of the, the door. Cause those

Victor: Do you remember? Sorry, go [01:00:00] ahead.

Olivia: No, go ahead.

Victor: Do you remember Zach saying anything? 

Olivia: yeah. 

I'm curious What


were I mean, he was just like, oh fuck. Godammit. Oh


Zach: all I was saying in my dream.

Olivia: That's what 



Victor: All right More similar than different

Olivia: The truck , the truck was like a very regular size in my dream. it was not 

like super 

large. And so like, to you on your side, it was like this impossible task.

And to me it looked like, like someone trying to like, sh like put a basketball in one of those like kid sized basketball hoops, like you're trying to dunk on like a six foot hoop and like fucking it up every time.

Zach: So, I wonder if there's significance that. Cause I feel like the significance in this one is gonna be more interesting in comparison, cuz for me to just do it in a vacuum, like just my dream, I think it's gonna be [01:01:00] similar to last week and, and the poop dreams where it's like you said about

embarrassment and, and lack of privacy 

Olivia: mm-hmm

Zach: but I'm curious what,

it means that I told you about it.

And then you like almost de meaningly had this like, outside

perspective where it go ahead.

Victor: sorry, uh, to me that would mean, uh, that, like, from your perspective, this is an impossible task, but for like an objective outside perspective, you're more getting in your own way than anything else. Like you're your own reason why you can't accomplish the task?

Zach: Yeah. I wonder if it has to do with work. I mean, that's where I saw Olivia every day, but, but my dream didn't include her. Well, maybe it did. I just didn't see her hiding in the Bush. I was like, oh,

Victor: that's 

Zach: But I wonder if it has to do with, like, I don't know whatever was going on at work at the time, like maybe I was, uh, venting to you, but it wasn't cuz our boss would like trade off who was in her [01:02:00] sights in terms of like punitive measures and who was the star child?

This might have been during a, a period of time where Olivia had it easy and I was like venting a lot. And from her perspective, it was. What's the problem,

you know?

Olivia: Maybe Um, I, I don't really remember, but I do remember this was after you, like this was, I think you were at whole foods, right?

Zach: Yeah. Actually I remember sending you the voicemail from the whole foods parking lot before I clocked in.

Olivia: Yeah.

Victor: Do you remember anything before or after this part of the dream? Or was this the whole dream for you? It was hiding in these bushes.

Olivia: it was like, I respond to this like place and I like am looking around and I turn around and I see Zach throwing this rubber butt at this truck. and I just kind of like ducked down. Um, yeah, no, [01:03:00] that was it. 

Victor: So when you say you like respond, it's like, do you remember like coming into sudden awareness of being there?

Mm-hmm you're like, oh, whoa. I was in darkness and now, yeah. Now there's treat, am I at a truck 


Olivia: Yes 


And then you're like, oh shit, hide.

Olivia: Hi.

Victor: and then you just hung it. So. Okay. Do you remember the resolution? Like did Zach give up, did he accomplish his goal?

Olivia: I don't recall. 


Zach: in my dream I eventually lost it.

Like I couldn't, I didn't get, I wasn't sure if I got it in the cab or not, but I couldn't find it. Like I walked around to the other side of the cab and it wasn't, I looked under it and

Olivia: I think I remember watching him do that for a while. And then feeling like I was like invading his privacy. I like, I didn't wanna embarrass him. But I can't stand up and leave. Cuz he would see me. So I just kind of like hung out there and I think I maybe stopped looking [01:04:00] after a while and just like, let him, do his thing.

Victor: So you're the whole experience for you seemed to be concern about embarrassing Zach.

Olivia: Yeah. And it was, it's kind of one of those situations where like, it would've been fine if I like walked by, but if, once you hide, then you have like, I 

don't know You're Yeah You've kind of already invaded the privacy by like, not making yourself like noticed, you know? 

Zach: Yeah. But what else are you gonna do? How are you gonna announce your presence that isn't gonna like, make me jump outta my shoes.

Victor: So,

Hey I, I don't know why I did this, but I was hiding in the bushes for about 10 minutes and I just can't watch you do this anymore. I gotta help.

Olivia: like, I really have to be somewhere so

Victor: we can talk about this later, but I gotta go.

Zach: So it


make sense. I forgot that I was at whole foods at the time. Cuz I got let go from that job that a living and I both had, it does make sense that I was tasked [01:05:00] with this like kind of,

I don't wanna call it menial cuz it's like a, it's a real job being a truck driver, but uh, it's hard labor.

and it's uh, not what I wanted to be doing.

So like it makes sense that I would be tasked with unloading this truck and that part of the task was embarrassing for me. Cause that's kinda how I felt at the time. Like getting fired sucks. It is, there's a lot of shame and embarrassment involved in that. Especially when you have to go back to an industry that you thought you had succeeded at leaving.

Victor: Yeah. I mean, the truck here might represent to you going back to like a non-creative job, you know, like for you working at whole foods kind of felt the same as if you were like your job was to unload a truck. It was like not really something that, um, you're invested in is just like a, a job.

Zach: Yeah. And there was an embarrassment to it at the time. because I, you know, thought I had

already found my lucky break with this other, with this other job and [01:06:00] podcasting and stuff. 

Victor: Yeah. So, so the sex doll in this dream is, uh, the embarrassment of your artistic aspirations or like your aspirations. It's like, it felt like this thing you've dragged along with you to this normal job that you have to do.

Zach: yeah. Cuz there was, I remember at the time there was a lot of, um,

You know, when you start a new job and there's just conversation amongst your, uh, cohorts, uh, just casual conversation and it comes up, you know, look, have you been working in, you know, cheese for a long time? It's like, well, no, I actually just came from like, I, I was reticent to like, I think I lied a lot and just said that I had always been doing, geez, I didn't want to like, admit that I had this other job that would

inspire them to be like, oh, that's very cool.

Why aren't you doing that? You know what I mean? And then I would've to be like, well, I failed at it.

Victor: Yeah. So then that the job you left is [01:07:00] probably the sex doll here. Right. 

And then hide. You're just having a hard time,

Zach: as what was left over Yeah. As what was left over after

Olivia: just 

Victor: Butt Was it dusty, old, rubber, but.

Zach: yeah. That's all I was left with after. after getting, let go from this job. Uh, and I was embarrassed by it and still didn't know how to, how to use it.

You know, you know what I mean? Cause I didn't know. Once I had that on my resume, I was like, well, I finally got a year under my belt of something that I want to be doing on my resume, but it kind of feels tarnished and I don't know what to do with it now.

Victor: And then ultimately losing it. Right. It's like, you're trying to get rid of it. It's this anxiety and then, oh, well it disappeared is maybe the part of you at the time that was trying to move on from that dream or put that dream aside.

Zach: Yeah.

I mean that all tracks and it also explains why

if Olivia was able to Intuit that at the [01:08:00] time and then see it from her perspective, this, this probably would've been around the time that she sort of like figured out how to. Mitigate the toxicity of that workplace does that 

Olivia: Um yeah, 

I had definitely 

learned how to navigate it in a way that like, I didn't let it get to me. And I put myself in a position of being the golden child for as long as possible. Like I stopped getting in trouble, um, for bullshit at a certain point.

Zach: Yeah. And you kind of knew how to redirect that

whatever was being thrown at you without getting in deeper trouble. Cuz that's ultimately, I think what, when awry with my situation at that place was that I reached the end of my rope. And instead of being tactful, like Olivia, I started just standing up for myself and um, I think it came off as obstinate.

and I eventually became more trouble than I was worth to them.

Olivia: [01:09:00] Yeah, they definitely did not want anybody challenging them or like in particular it was like she wanted, to be able to like criticize you for stuff that made absolutely no sense without you questioning it, you know? Cuz it wasn't about you doing something wrong.

It was about like 


Zach: Yeah. And once you figured out how to like, navigate borderline, like manipulate this, like narcissist that we worked for, I'm sure to you, they went from seeming like a, a pit bull to like a little Chihuahua that if you just gave them the right treat at the right time, it wasn't, 

or, or in this case, or in this case from a giant fucking truck to a regular size one.

Olivia: Yeah I think that, I think that nails it.

Victor: We're just setting these up and knocking 'em down, just clearing out dream meetings left and right. and it's all work all the time.

Zach: I just started getting other stuff going on in my life so that I have more, more, uh, [01:10:00] nuanced streams like you.

 Today I was gonna do one. I had a few weeks ago that was like, kind of a nightmare, but then just through this conversation we got along, like we figured out sort of a theme or. Trajectory.

Olivia: yeah 

I'm just curious to see if there's like other things that we're, um, dreaming about on the same nights, you know?

Victor: Yeah. You guys might have a lot more overlapping dreams than you realize.

Zach: mm-hmm I just hope I start. I hope I start seeing you Victor, whenever I'm in trouble.

Victor: I'm probably there for all of them. I just 

Olivia: don't 

Victor: remember them at all. I was hiding under the desk the whole time.

I was saying earlier though, I think it's really healthy and good that I'm not, I'm rarely the focal point of your dreams.

Yeah. I'm usually just like a helpful or supportive like side character. Cause I 

think if you're feel 

right, if you were dreaming about me a lot, it would maybe indicate that you were working through something with me. [01:11:00] Yeah. But instead I'm just like, I'm sorted, I'm solved and I'm just there to like lend support when needed while you deal with other


Olivia: That's totally true 

Victor: And then it, it's interesting. These, the couple of Shared dreams where Zach is like a key role. It seems to indicate like you guys being in the trenches together in a work situation. 

Olivia: that's so funny.

Victor: It's like you're in it together with Zach you're in a problem 

with Zach. 

And so you're working through it with him.

Olivia: Yeah.

Zach: Yeah. The first one being like on something on the horizon and the, uh, second one being something in the past.

Olivia: Yeah.

Zach: present at the time, but.

And then you're good old Clippy. It's popping up with the little word bubble, like looks like you're trying to sort through issues with your dad.

Olivia: dad.

Victor: Looks like you're having a nightmare. Is there anything I can get 

Olivia: you? 

Yeah All right, guys. Thank you for listening to The Jung and the Restless

Zach: You can

follow us on Instagram at The Jung and the Restless pod. And if you want us to interpret your dreams, [01:12:00] submit them to The Jung and the Restless pod at Gmail,

Victor: And as we always say,

Olivia, Zach, and Victor: no ifs, ands, or rubber butts. 

 Oh, hey, what's up? Didn't see you there. Hey, since you're still here, how about you dip on over to Apple Podcast and leave us a review. And by the way, put, put, put a dream in the [01:13:00] description and we'll read one each week on the show. Thanks. 

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