14. Hurry Up and Wait

Olivia may need to go to therapy in order to parse through her recent dream trends, because she’s reluctant to…...

Olivia may need to go to therapy in order to parse through her recent dream trends, because she’s reluctant to do it on the pod. Zach has a dream about comedians and aliens, which Olivia somehow helps him unpack from the astral plane. Victor may also need to go to therapy, but he doesn’t want to, so unlike his spouse, he ends up spilling quite a few guts on the pod about creating art, social anxieties, and general overarching shame. 

0:00 intro

11:20 Olivia needs therapy

23:18 Zach's dream

1:01:17 Victor needs therapy

About Dream Bible:

Dream Bible is a free online A to Z dream dictionary dedicated to helping people understand the meaning of their dreams. Unlike other dream interpretation websites or books we extensively research dream symbols by interviewing people about the events occurring in their lives at the time of their dreams.  Inspired by the work of Gillian Holloway Ph.D, we are using a database of over 350,000 dream reports to create the world's most practical dream dictionary based on the waking life experiences of regular people.


Dream Bible entries used in this episode:

Young: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=young

Rescue: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=rescue

UFO: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=ufo

Airplanes: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=Airplanes

Aliens: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=aliens

Comedy: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=comedy

Zoo: https://www.dreambible.com/search.php?q=zoo

Follow us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thejungandtherestlesspod/

Check out our website for episode transcripts: https://thejungandtherestlesspodcast.com/

Submit your dreams for interpretation to thejungandtherestlesspod@gmail.com

Episode Transcript

14. Hurry Up and Wait

[00:00:00] Zach: Welcome to The Jung and the Restless. I'm Zach.

[00:00:02] Olivia: I'm Olivia

[00:00:03] Victor: And I'm Victor. And this is the podcast where you probably wouldn't care if we just dropped dead tomorrow. What's you So bitter

[00:00:33] Zach: and I, it's driving me crazy cuz I, I had a dream that I woke up like laughing really hard at like to the point where I was having a hard time falling back asleep cause I was laughing too much and I can't remember what was so funny. 

[00:00:47] Olivia: Hypnogogic 

[00:00:47] Zach: Blue Balls. This was before, before I knew the name of the episode.

Yeah. Oh, I thought you were saying that the title was What was making me laugh? No, no, it's not. You're saying that I'm currently having hypnogogic Blue Blue? 

[00:00:58] Olivia: Yeah. I mean, that kind of is hypnogogic blue balls, 

[00:01:01] Zach: right? Oh, totally. And comedy blue balls. I wanna know what my brain came up with that was so fucking funny that I couldn't fall back asleep.


[00:01:09] Victor: But like, you know, that if you thought of it, you'd be like, uh, that wasn't that funny. 

[00:01:14] Zach: Probably knowing, knowing my brain. I mean, today I made, I cracked myself up because I referred to Rain as cloud sauce, . And I was like, that's not that funny. I'm just, I know. 

[00:01:25] Victor: That's pretty good. I 

[00:01:27] Zach: like that. I just highly entertained by myself.

[00:01:30] Olivia: I had a dream the other night where I was comforting this guy who was sad because his partner cheated on him. Um, and I said, oh, at least you have Charla. And I look over and he's holding this like, huge portrait of a horse that looks like derpy as fuck. And I guess that horse's name was Charla. And it was spelled like Charla Char

Like, like l e i g h. Like how some people spell like Ashley or Kayleigh or whatever. 

[00:02:04] Zach: Charlie. I, I like the idea of naming an Amal with an accent. . This h this horse's name is Charlie. But you have to say it like a British person. Charlie. Charlie, 

[00:02:17] Olivia: don't come at us. Brits British listeners. 

[00:02:20] Zach: I ain't scared. 

[00:02:22] Olivia: Uh, do we wanna, what was that called?

The, the thing you sent us the other day, the New Year Dream thing? 

[00:02:28] Zach: That was Victor. Oh, that was Victor. 

[00:02:31] Victor: Oh yeah. Yeah. I sent a, a thing. 

[00:02:34] Zach: Yeah, I didn't even attempt to pronounce it. Tsu. Yume, yeah. The first dream, first dream of the new year. Traditionally, the contents of such a dream would forte the luck of the dreamer in the ensuing year.

Do either of you remember your first dream of the new year? 

[00:02:53] Olivia: Yeah, I do. Um, yeah, I had a dream that I was, yeah, I had a dream that I was with a group of people on an ice block near the ocean, and then I was suddenly floating out on this ice block away from the mainland, and there were a couple people with me, and then there were two orca whales that came and gave us a ride back to shore and reunited us with the group.

Oh yeah. I've also been having dreams lately where I'm a kid. How old are 

[00:03:26] Victor: you in these 

[00:03:27] Olivia: dreams? Um, it kind of depends, but like, uh, actually, Well, it's only happened a couple times, but lately it's been a few times and I've been maybe around like 12. Um, also something I was saying to Victor earlier is that I feel like my dreams pre-wedding were about kind of superficial stuff or, or like, just things that were kind of easy for me to be like, oh yeah, I've been worried about that.

Um, and like lately my dreams, I've had a harder time, like knowing what they might mean or, or connecting the dots and that it's like, uh, like getting married takes up so much space, right? That it's like a lot of my concerns are like even slightly related to that, right? And now that that's out of the way, um, I feel like my subconscious is like giving me dreams about things that I'm like not even really aware of yet.

And so, 

[00:04:24] Zach: yeah. Yeah, we talked about that in the last episode, right? Yeah, 

[00:04:27] Olivia: I think we did, we did get into it a little bit, but I'm, I'm like, Realizing that like, pre-wedding, my dreams were very easy for me to get to the bottom of. And I feel like that in, in the same way that like planning a wedding and, and, um, being engaged or whatever is like, it is inherently distracting, you know, from the rest of everything going on with you.

It's a, it's a big thing that takes up a lot of space. And so, like without a big thing taking up a lot of space, I am now maybe being sent messages from my subconscious. It's like, here's stuff that you haven't even thought about looking at . 

[00:05:08] Zach: Right. And you just got a new job, so, Hmm. Like that's that stress taken care of for now, you know?

Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I guess, so it, it sounds like you're in a, a, a spot where you have the, um, freedom to like dig a little deeper when it comes to like psychological growth. 

[00:05:26] Olivia: Yeah. Yeah, that's probably true. And I'm doing it publicly. 

[00:05:30] Zach: For art. Hell yeah. You're welcome. listener. 

[00:05:35] Victor: Yeah. There have been like a couple big changes since the wedding.

Like the, the wedding itself didn't feel like, um, like it felt like a, a buildup to something that was important and exciting and we were happy to get all those people together and have a good party and like have a very memorable day. But like our relationship didn't change. Mm-hmm. from getting married and we came home, we very much like after our honeymoon, we very much like settled back into the life we were in when we decided to get married.


[00:06:07] Olivia: kept asking, how's the married life? , , 

[00:06:10] Victor: it's the same. So like, the marriage wasn't like a big change, but there has been like a few, like, like you, uh, like the new job and then um, like just various new circumstances right. Over the last couple of months. So maybe that's changing your, your mindset.

[00:06:27] Zach: Yeah. Yeah, it doesn't seem like, other than like getting used to being like, this is my husband instead of, you know, my fiance or whatever. Like, there's little things like that to get used to, but like, yeah, I 

[00:06:41] Olivia: think that that didn't change any, like getting, getting married was, uh, for us a decision to keep doing exactly what we're doing rather than to take it to the next step.

It's not, it was not a next step. It was just like a big expensive party to let everyone know that we're just gonna keep on doing this . 

[00:07:04] Victor: Yeah. I think that's like a trap people can get sucked into when they like, think that getting married should be the thing that will change the relationship or fix the relationship or, you know, these problems will go away when we're married or whatever.

Like, I think you can fool yourself into that, but I, I don't think that works out a lot of the time for people. 

[00:07:25] Olivia: No. Yeah, I think that, I think that, like I've seen a few people get really excited to get engaged, um, when the relationship that they're in is actually not, you know, working that well. And, um, but getting engaged can be like super exciting and like, it's almost just like, you don't have to think about that because now you're getting married and like you can just put that aside for now.

And I imagine that in that situation, it's like once the, once the honeymoon bliss wears off, right? Um, you're then there, you're then back to where you were. And it's maybe even an escalation of, of where things were going because now there's not like, well maybe we'll, we'll get married to look forward to

[00:08:16] Zach: Yeah. It's like the pink cloud effect, like when people get sober there, there's like, A period of time where you're like just elated to not be full of toxins. You know, like your body starts releasing these endorphins, they make you feel really good cuz you're, you know, you feel like how you're supposed to like, not under the influence of chemicals, but then once that wears off, there's a huge like, spike in, in, um, relapse.

Mm-hmm. . Yeah. I believe that sort of a weird analogy, uh, 

[00:08:48] Victor: that makes sense to me. That like, um, like there's a connection between like life being unfulfilling and being pulled towards like an addiction. Right. And so like once you are out of your addiction, you were still deposited back into a life that's maybe unfulfilling, you know?

And, um, makes sense to me that there'd be a risk of relapse. 

[00:09:11] Zach: Yeah. But that was obviously not like, At all. The vibe, the vibes at your wedding were like immaculate aw . And I think, I mean, people were talking about this, it's, I think part of that was the, um, what was in the atmosphere is like, this makes sense.

They should get married. Hmm. That's so sweet. And so that's nice. That's a, that's a relaxed vibe to be in where everyone's like, there's just no tension. I don't know if you've ever been to a wedding where you're like, Hmm, I don't know. This is like the best idea. , but we're not, I guess we're not gonna stop 'em.

So let's, let's hit the bar. 

[00:09:46] Olivia: No. Yeah, for sure. Um, well, it's like, it's really good to hear that, um, people feel that way about, we feel that way about us, so, 

[00:09:55] Zach: yeah. Yeah. I mean, obviously, 

[00:09:58] Olivia: yeah. But yeah, like, I mean, I don't, I guess I don't feel like there's like, I don't know. Yeah, I guess, uh, uh, what I'm getting at is it's not that there's like some crazy blocked memory thing.

Like, I don't know if I'm putting out that vibe about it, , but it's not that there's like a big crazy thing that I need to confront. I don't think that that's the situation. I think it's just like I'm in a place where I'm maybe, um, like I'm in a place where that's gonna be possible. And so, uh, I am, I'm having a harder time connecting the dots in dream interpretation because I feel like we're, we're now in an, in an area where I'm dreaming about things that I, I haven't spent time talking to Victor about, or I haven't like, spent a lot of time thinking about it or, yeah.

So it's just like, it's not, um, connecting the way that other things. Were before. Do you my, my like, surface level problems that I was dreaming about, were like, oh yeah, this is the problem that I've been talking about in my life. 

[00:11:03] Victor: Do you feel like, um, there's any through lines in these dreams you're having that you're, um, not sure what to make of, like you're, are there any recurring themes, characters, or situations or dynamics that are coming up in these dreams?

Um, yeah. 

[00:11:20] Olivia: So they're, uh, again, like the last two dreams that I wrote down, I was a kid. Um, and then they're, I've had some like unpleasant dreams where like I'm, uh, in danger or like, um, other people are in danger or, yeah, actually no. All of the , yeah, all of my dreams are like danger dreams right now. Um, like honestly, if I, hang on one second.

I just wanna look like, give you the rundown of like the last five, cuz I feel like if I look at them, so like drifting away on the block of ice, right. Um, I had the one before that was I was in a car accident and um, the cops, the cop was trying to trick me. Uh, and the one before that was like being a kid in this weird, fun house maze where clowns were like killing people and geez.

Uh, then before that there were zombies and yeah, no, it's just like, yeah, I'm having like, you're endangered dreams actually pass. 

[00:12:25] Victor: Yeah. So I remember, um, we talked about the kids being killed by clown's Dream. I don't know if you want to get into that, um, in detail, but I remember, uh, that dream ended with some adult character coming in and kind of saving the day in a really bizarre fashion.

Oh, this 

[00:12:43] Olivia: actually does kind of make sense with some stuff with me 

[00:12:47] Zach: that's like, uh, The orcas and the other, and the ice cream. That's what 

[00:12:51] Victor: I was thinking. Yeah. Yeah. So, mm-hmm. , are you, are there other, like, saviors in these dreams? 

[00:12:57] Olivia: Okay. Yeah. That's interesting. Um, the last couple have had that, but I don't know if that's necessarily a, a through line.


[00:13:06] Zach: But you said you might have like a, a real life connection that you made, or you, you said something about this might actually make sense with what's going on. Yeah. Hmm. Do you want to elaborate or you don't have to? Uh, 

[00:13:18] Olivia: should I like tell a dream or should we talk about everything more generally? What do you guys think?

[00:13:27] Victor: Um, well, so I pulled up some dream Bible entries that seem to like broadly apply to the overall themes that are coming up in these dreams. And we can just look at 'em and see if that sparks anything for us. And then maybe Dr. Dig into a specific dream. And maybe like with the context of the Dream Bible entries, we might get a little further with it or something.

Okay, sure. Okay. So what I, what I pulled up as young, uh, being young, uh, we got danger and we've got rescue. So, uh, young to dream of being young represents new enthusiasm or feelings of vigor, a fresh outlook on your life, a renewed sense of interest, motivation, or vitality. New ideas are wanting to try something new.

Now, I think for you, usually when you're dreaming of being young, it's in the negative because you're in danger, right? Yes. Being young is like a vulnerability or a liability for you, correct. So negatively, Being young may reflect naive. Oh, may being young may reflect naive, idealistic, that's how they wrote it, or impractical ideas or attitudes.

It may also reflect inexperience being new on the scene or being prone to making a mistake. Childishness or maturity. Okay. What, what's the bottom? Uh, alternatively being young may reflect your preoccupation with your past, dwelling too much on the past, your regrets or lost opportunities, a sign that you were having difficulty moving on.

So you being young, negatively is naive. Uh, being idealistic or impractical. Inexperienced mistakes, childishness immaturity. So danger to dream of feeling. A sense of danger represents feelings of risk threats or potential failure, feeling that a loss is imminent. It may be a sign that you need to be more open about your fears or anxieties with others.

Alternatively, danger in a dream may also reflect your feeling of having gone too far with a problem, a sign that you need to reverse course or be honest in waking life situation. 

[00:15:38] Olivia: Going back, sorry, going back to young, um, there were like a list, there was like a list of adjectives there. Uh, like, like, okay.

Like inexperienced, naive, um, childishness immaturity. Like that's, uh, doesn't quite hit. But the what does is like, um, cl maybe closely related, which is like vulnerable and like, um, kind of helpless I guess. Like that's, I think what the feeling of being a child in a dream for me is. 

[00:16:13] Victor: Hmm. Okay. So, uh, yeah, we've got helplessness, right?

And then danger, um, which is. Risk of threats or potential failure, feeling that a loss is imminent, may be a sign that you need to be more open about fears or anxieties or that you've gone too far in a situation and need to reverse course. So I sounds like, you know, doubt, anxiety, um, I have that fear of loss, that kind of thing.

You know, 

[00:16:45] Zach: what are you doubtful and anxious about, 

[00:16:47] Olivia: you know, getting 

[00:16:49] Victor: married, , 

[00:16:51] Zach: just generalized, like life 

[00:16:53] Olivia: anxiety, generalized anxiety. Yeah. No, I, I think, um, yeah, I mean like doubtful and anxious, uh, like, uh, Yeah, I mean it's um, it's, it's like a self-perception thing for me. I think like a lot of my anxiety comes from like, um, how I, how I feel I am being perceived by others and if I am like, doing well in general, like if I'm doing a good job, like whether that means like succeeding at work or like, um, being a good friend or like not making other people uncomfortable or whatever.

I don't know. But it can present itself in a variety of ways. But it's usually like doubting, uh, the doubt would be like my doubting my abilities are like, um, and like anxious about. Yeah, just, it's usually to do with other people actually, I would. 

[00:17:54] Victor: Hmm. And then, uh, we have rescue. Uh, so to dream of rescuing someone represents feelings about an urgent need to be spared from neglect, danger, or situations that leave you feeling overwhelmed, feeling desperate to escape a problem.

Alternatively, it may represent waking life situations where you are carrying someone through a bad time or sparing someone trouble. Taking a stand or stepping up burdens, you need to escape. 

[00:18:21] Olivia: Do you think we can just apply that? Because like, I'm not rescuing anybody, I'm being rescued, right? Yeah. Um, but do you think it, well, there's a section.

Here's just 

[00:18:31] Victor: apply. Oh, okay. To dream of being rescued represents help or opportunities that are restoring something that has gone wrong. You may feel that someone in your life is carrying you through a problem or saving you from disaster at the last moment. Positively being rescued may reflect your own efforts to finally stand up to a problem or spare yourself of trouble.

Negatively being rescued may reflect your unwillingness to deal with problems until they get out of hand. You may be too proud to do something for yourself. A reflection of your cry for help or feelings of desperation. 

[00:19:06] Olivia: Yeah. So like, um, being rescued may reflect your own efforts to finally stand up to a problem or spare yourself the trouble, like, uh, like I was just saying, it's like I don't, I feel like I am probably getting these dreams that I can't interpret because I'm like in a place to maybe go there right now, I guess.

I don't know. 

[00:19:32] Zach: You're in a place too. What do you mean? 

[00:19:35] Olivia: Meaning that like, if I'm dreaming of being rescued, that might mean that like, like. It says, positively being rescued may reflect your own efforts to finally stand up to a problem. Um, right. So like if my problem is something that I have not addressed or like dealt with, that makes sense because I'm having dreams about being in a place, I'm having dreams about it, right?

I'm having dreams that I can't put together. 

[00:20:00] Victor: Okay, so we've got just, just a recap real quick. We've got, um, being young, which is, um, in the Bible naive or, um, being impractical and experienced, childish, immature. And then, um, for you, you also think it represents maybe like feeling vulnerable or feeling, um, you know, uh, in danger in some way.

And then we have danger, which is, uh, feeling that, you know, something is on the line, loss is imminent. Um, anxiety, fear, uh, and then being rescued. Which is like maybe being at a place where you're ready to confront a problem that has been bubbling under the surface. So it all feels, it feels kind of disconnected.

We're not like, we haven't penetrated the meaning of the thing yet, but like, uh, maybe good context for if we were to look at a specific dream. Yeah. 

[00:21:00] Olivia: Let's do that another time, . 

[00:21:03] Zach: Okay. Let's do what another 

[00:21:04] Victor: time. You seem like you're frustrated by this. Yeah. I don't know. I was, what is that? 

[00:21:12] Zach: I was just gonna say I don't, I don't know if this came up in the last episode.

I might have already thrown this theory out there, but do you think your dreams lately maybe have to do with this podcast and like, pressure to come up with something profound? 

[00:21:25] Victor: No, 

[00:21:27] Olivia: because we didn't, no, it's not that we released. It's not that. It's not that 

[00:21:31] Zach: because we're just like a month into like actually releasing stuff.

So like people are actually hearing us for the first time. 

[00:21:37] Olivia: I don't think it's at all pressure to come up with something profound. I don't think that's it. And I think if anything it is, if it is related to the podcast, it's to do with, um, it actually being out there. We're like talking about our personal lives and like, that's, that's what I mean, everyone we know is listening

[00:21:55] Zach: Yeah. That's what I like. Yeah. I guess that's what I mean is the anxiety that comes from that, like having an audience and specifically an audience for like Yeah. 

[00:22:04] Olivia: Psychological kinda digging. Yeah. It's like go into therapy with a peanut gallery. Like 

[00:22:08] Victor: do you feel like, um, you have a sense of what the meaning might be or like a little bit of an insight into what it might be and you're not comfortable getting into it on the podcast?


[00:22:21] Zach: I, yeah. Are you hiding stuff from us? Olivia? . That's valid. 

[00:22:25] Victor: No, that's totally valid from 

[00:22:26] Zach: you. . Wait, did Oh, I didn't hear what you said. Did you say Yeah. ? Yeah. Oh, okay. over here making fun of you. , 

[00:22:34] Olivia: I feel like, um, Uh, yeah, I feel like maybe I'll just le leave. Maybe this will be a cliffhanger and I feel like it's something that I'm like aware of and I would like to consider how I wanna talk about it.


[00:22:50] Zach: Well, it'll be an ongoing, an ongoing plot thread at the Sure, sure, sure.

I have one that I was rearing to do. Do it. Do it. Let's see. 12, 15. It's a couple weeks old. Crack another beer for it. All right, so, I was at a comedy club and I just, I wasn't really paying attention. Um, it was like a moody underground kind of, uh, comedy, like, like mood moody lighting is what I mean. Um, oh yeah.

And I felt like I recognized the place. Like I, I, I feel like, like a popular TV show was shot there, but, uh, and so that's like kinda what I was thinking about instead of paying attention to the show. And then I noticed that the comedian who's on stage is now sitting, uh, at my table across from me. And, uh, everyone's watching and he says into the mic, uh, let me ask you something.

Am I full of bullshit? And he puts the mic in my face and I'm picking up on the fact that this is like a catchphrase or something, and I'm supposed to say something. And I, I was just like, I don't know who you are. And then he's like, clearly flustered and he's like trying to improvise and recover. And he's like, whoa, what did you do last night?

And I remembered in real life, I was just talking, uh, to my girlfriend. Uh, and like right up until I fell asleep, so I was like, uh, I talked to a girl until I fell asleep and nobody laughed. And he didn't know what to say and I was like, oh, that was like too cute and sincere for like, for comedy, you know?

And then after that I'm walking with, do you know who Tim Hyd Decker is? Yeah. Yeah. Tim. Tim and Eric. I was walking with him through like a zoo and uh, he's giving me shit for how the comedy show went . And uh, I asked him like what, I asked him if it was cringe as fuck, and he goes, yeah, it was total cringe.

Fuck. That's a great word for it. . Uh, and he just kept mishearing me like that, . And he was like, so you woke up to a talking girl? That's creepy. And I was like, no. I felt asleep talking to a girl. And he just, he didn't seem. Hear anything I said. Um, and at some point the zoo turns into like a baseball arena.

And, and Tim is also my friend Nick in real life, this is the person I actually know. And like, he runs into friends of his and we just all get separated and like lost in the, in the shuffle. And I can't, it's like this giant baseball arena and I can't get anywhere I need to go. Like I want to use the bathroom, but there's just like, oh yeah, people are, and at one point I'm trying to get to the parking lot, but people just, the, everyone's in my way,

It's just like shoulder to shoulder people and they won't move. And the, the, yeah, the bathroom's crowded. The concession stand is crowded. So at one point I give up and somehow I get back on this, uh, bike path, this like totally secluded bike path that exists in Castle Rock, Colorado where my family used to live.

And I'm just like, I'm walking alone and I'm muttering to myself like. I don't know. This guy's inside jokes. I don't know what I'm supposed to say at the Comedy Club. . Like, I was just like still bitter about this comedy show. And then at one point I look up and it's like, the sky's like purple and there are two planes that look like they're in mid takeoff, uh, but they're like frozen in the air and they're like kind of intertwined, like one wing is above the tail of the other and they're just frozen there.

And I'm wondering like, what, what's, you know, I'm wondering about that . And I'm try, I'm thinking to myself like, what is happening? And that's when I hear your voice, Olivia. Hmm. Like in my, in my head, like telepathically go, it's because the aliens want them . And that's when I noticed that there's a U F O emerging from like the suburbs nearby.

Uh, and I get like super excited cuz you know how I feel about UFOs. Yeah. And I'm like fumbling with my camera. I'm trying to take a picture. The pictures are all turning out shitty. Because this u f O is gonna like scoop up these planes. It's frozen in the sky. Uh, and just gradually it does that dream thing where you like gradually change location.

And I realize that what I'm taking a picture of is actually a TV screen above a bed, like in a hospital. And I'm in the bed and I'm, what's on TV is like some like chinsy show about aliens. 

[00:27:33] Olivia: Hmm. In the hos you're in the hospital. 

[00:27:37] Zach: Uh, not really. It felt more homey than that, but, but it was that kind of setup, you know, like caught kind of bed with a TV over it.

Mm-hmm. and it's like, yeah, this, this show that's like cgi, like really cheap CGI of UFOs. Was that the whole dream? Yeah, that's all the parts that are related. . It was one of, there were other parts. It was longer, but like I kind of Gotcha. Boiled it down to the, the through line of the. 

[00:28:04] Olivia: Yeah. Uh, the first thing that came up, like before you got to the Tim Hy Decker part, I was thinking like, it seems like you feel responsible for other people.

Like you felt responsible for that guy's comedy set B like you caused him to bomb somehow. Like, and, um, and then there were like, there was like misunderstandings in the early part. The early part seemed like much about like your, uh, like, like interpersonal interactions, like the comedy club through the Tim Hyd Decker part.

And then it seems like the other part was maybe like, maybe it was, it's a different representation of the same thing, but like this seemed like distinctly different, 

[00:28:50] Zach: um, part Yeah, it's a U f o U F O part. I feel like kind of it was transitioning into a new dream. 

[00:28:56] Olivia: I have lots of U F O dreams too. That's like a theme in my dreams.

[00:29:01] Zach: Yeah, we've talked about this, how yours, but your yours are scary to you, right? They're Yeah, 

[00:29:06] Olivia: they're horrifying. They're terrifying. 

[00:29:08] Zach: Yeah. Mine are always like this, where I get super excited. Hmm. 

[00:29:12] Olivia: Wait, let's read the U F O 

[00:29:13] Victor: entry. I have so many tabs open right now. Um, okay. U f O to dream of A U F O represents experiences or situations that are unfamiliar, unexplainable, or strange.

You may be having thoughts, emotions, or life situations that are unusual for you. A U F O may also reflect your ability to navigate an unusual situation in your life. A U F O is a sign that you are experiencing changes in ways you haven't experienced them before. U F o visions or dreams are common for people who take ayahuasca because they symbolize the unusual experiences or feelings a person has while under its influence.

The UFOs reflect the unexplainable nature of the intense spiritual occurrences or the feelings of knowing someone you can't see is around. You 

[00:30:03] Zach: see, like interesting that's, I've never done ayahuasca, but I've been talking about it. Mm-hmm. Really? 

[00:30:09] Olivia: Yeah. About you're like, you're thinking about doing 

[00:30:11] Zach: it. Not anytime soon, but I'm way more open to the idea.


[00:30:15] Olivia: Than I ever have. You're more open to that, to doing ayahuasca than like other hallucinogens. Oh, for sure. That's 

[00:30:24] Zach: interesting. Mm-hmm. ? Well, I've tried a couple others and had bad experiences, but I don't think ayahuasca is supposed to be fun. I think it's supposed to be a enlightening kind of thing 

[00:30:36] Olivia: that's just interesting that like a U f O dream to like, uh, You're, maybe let me know if those resonates, but like with this interpretation, it would be like, you're excited by change in new experiences and like strange new happenings in your life.

Um mm-hmm. , whereas I'm terrified of them. . 

[00:30:59] Victor: Right? It's the worst thing you can imagine. Olivia imminent doom. Um, so just to kind of recap, cuz I, I, I agree with Olivia. The first half of that, um, felt kind of reminiscent of dreams I've been having lately and, and Oh yeah. Like social navigation stuff and then it gets very much into like symbols.

It's like very abstract. Yeah. After a certain point. So I have a bunch of tabs open in the Dream Bible. I got just run through what we got. Comedy, comedian, zoo baseball, crowds, airplanes, aliens. And then we just did UFOs, 

[00:31:41] Olivia: comedy, comedian, zoo airplanes, . 

[00:31:46] Victor: Um, I don't know that I should just start reading, rattling these off, but, um, I, I have 

[00:31:51] Zach: some thoughts.

I do. Oh, go ahead. No, no, you go ahead, . I was just gonna say, I have dreams about comedy all the fucking times. Yeah. Yeah. That's sometimes interview, sometimes I'm on stage. And I think I've talked about this before too, where whenever I have a dream about performing music, which is the thing that I'm actually good at, , I, it always goes poorly.

Like my guitar is not working, or like people aren't into it, or I don't know the song. Hmm. It's just, it sounds bad, like music dreams are always stressful, but whenever I'm performing comedy in a dream, I'm always crushing it. , which I tried standup for like six months and it's not for me. I'm, I never crushed it in real life.


[00:32:31] Olivia: People have bad taste. We think you're funny. 

[00:32:34] Victor: And you think you're funny, which is 

[00:32:36] Olivia: why that's true. cloud sauce. If you're laughing, they'll start laughing with you. Right. , that's the key. Make your jokes and then just laugh. 

[00:32:45] Zach: That's the, yeah. Trying comedy was a good, like lesson and being confident on stage.

Mm-hmm. . 

[00:32:51] Olivia: Yeah. Cause once you bomb Yeah. What's, it's the worst thing that can happen, 

[00:32:56] Zach: right? That's it. Yeah. But, uh, yeah. So comedy is a recurring theme. Yeah. Usually I'm on stage, sometimes I'm waiting to go on stage. Sometimes. This is the only time that I've had a dream where I was like, an audience member in the show was being thrust on me and I didn't want it.

Hmm mm-hmm. Because that was all the social stuff. In the first half of the dream, the vibe from me was like, irritants. Hmm. Like, I wasn't really, I didn't feel. Anxious or worried that I fucked up these social situations. I was like, irritated by all of them, and I didn't want to, by the time I was on that secluded bike path, I, I felt more content, although I was still like, obviously like annoyed by everything that had happened.

[00:33:40] Victor: And it's interesting that like you were experiencing this social, um, annoyance, like people are bothering you and then that culminates in being like swallowed by a crowd and trying to get out of it. It's very like the people problems ramped up. Yeah, 

[00:33:54] Zach: yeah, yeah. And everybody was like, just like, literally physically in my way.

Mm-hmm. . Um, and I have this right before Christmas, right before I left la so it could, that part of it could be, um, very real and conscious frustrations with living in a big city that I have all the time. You 

[00:34:14] Victor: said you had thoughts, Olivia? Yeah. 

[00:34:16] Olivia: Well, do we wanna go through the dream chronologically or, because I, I have some like, Thoughts about random things, but, 

[00:34:23] Victor: um, I think let's get some random thoughts out 

[00:34:26] Olivia: there.

All right. Just dive. Alright. Some random thoughts that I have, uh, cuz your, your image of the airplanes and the purple sky, uh, sticks out to me as like a very symbolic moment. We talked about purple a lot. Purple has come up quite a bit and, and as like a, um, a symbol of neutrality, right? Um, was it a light purple or like a dark purple 

[00:34:49] Zach: or, uh, dark purple.

It was like a realistic, like it wasn't weird that this guy was purple, you know what I mean? Like, it felt like it was like astronomical twilight. Mm-hmm. Right? 

[00:34:59] Olivia: Um, but, but it was purple still. And there were two, two planes doing like a 

[00:35:06] Zach: a Yeah, they almost looked like they had glitched out in a video game, like, cuz they were overlapped.

It was like two, I was 

[00:35:12] Olivia: picturing like two birds mating midair, but. 

[00:35:16] Zach: Yeah, it wasn't quite that intimate. It was more like they had fucked up, like they weren't supposed to be, whatever you call it, slipped out, whatever you call it in a video game. Like nodes like mm-hmm. Char characters like glitching 

[00:35:27] Victor: out.

They clicked through each 

[00:35:28] Zach: other. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And then they were frozen there and um, yeah. And that was when it was like, I had this dream right after we recorded an episode, so that might have been why it was Olivia's voice. But it was funny the way I thought a question and then a different voice answered me.

Hmm. I was like, why are those planes frozen? And then I heard Olivia go, it's cuz the aliens want them. . 

[00:35:49] Victor: She was helping you analyze your dream from within your dream ? 

[00:35:53] Zach: Yeah, after we had already stopped recording, I just kept doing the podcast in my sleep. , 

[00:36:00] Olivia: what do airplanes mean? 

[00:36:04] Victor: So airplanes were these negative airplanes?

[00:36:09] Zach: Uh oh no, I wouldn't say negative. 

[00:36:11] Olivia: They were very neutral. Just 

[00:36:12] Victor: like this guy. Yes. Would you. 

[00:36:14] Zach: I was interested in them. Like the, my feeling was, I guess I would call it positive cuz it was a feeling of like awe and wonder. 

[00:36:22] Victor: Would you say they were crashing? No. No. Didn't feel like a plane crash, do you? No.

[00:36:28] Zach: They're like paralyzed. They're like frozen in time. Uh, 

[00:36:32] Olivia: an airplane that aborts a flight? Yeah. What does 

[00:36:35] Victor: that mean? A tough flight? Um, I imagine like you're on your way somewhere and then they're like, no, we have to land 

[00:36:42] Olivia: unstop flying. Oh, I thought it was that. They push a button and everyone falls out the floor.

[00:36:49] Victor: Let's see, we've also got, um, flying to another country. Invisible airplane and then invisible airplane. Yeah. It's like a Wonder Woman thing. Oh yeah. Did you have an invisible jet plane or something? Oh, yeah. Um, but in this, it says, uh, it may reflect feelings of uncertainty about your progress and situation.


[00:37:08] Olivia: So just regular 

[00:37:10] Victor: airplanes. Okay. Plain old airplanes, uh, to dream of an airplane represents the trajectory or momentum of plans, ideas, or projects that you wish to get off the ground positively. Airplanes are a reflection of successful experiences that are progressing, everything coming together to ensure desired controlled outcome.

Dreams of airplanes can sometimes reflect our feelings about people dying or the journey of death, uh, 

[00:37:35] Olivia: blah, blah, blah. Is this a dream about the podcast? Because it's like, it's a project getting off the ground, a project getting off the ground, and um, and then like immediately my voice comes in, um, and it's like they're kind of, it's glitching out, right?

Like something is maybe stalling or, I don't know. Is it like a maybe a fear of like the, about the success of this project? 

[00:38:01] Zach: I don't think it's fear. The predominant feeling wasn't fear, it was curiosity. Um, but the, but it is interesting that the, um, the, the answer to the question, what are those planes doing, is it's because the aliens want them.

And then a u f o like emerged from the horizon to presumably like, take the plane to suck these airplanes up into it, you know? 

[00:38:26] Victor: And that's all about, uh, unfamiliar or new experiences, right? So that would connect, right? Because we're doing a, we're doing our podcast for the first time, the u 

[00:38:36] Olivia: f Okay. Say the airplanes symbolize the, the project.

Right. And the u f O is the podcast launch, cuz that's the unfamiliar territory. We've been here recording for quite a while. And then the new thing is the aliens have come to take our podcast and put it out to the world. . 

[00:39:00] Zach: This is, um, I have a job, a gig going on right now, uh, in, in, in the podcast world. Uh, and it's very exciting.

It's, it's not full-time. It's, it's like I'm, I'm hoping it will turn into something full-time. I'm hop hoping this will grow into like, um, a, a job and not just a gig, but, you know, in the meantime I gotta pay rent. And, uh, and I'm, I'm very stressed about that right now. It's kind of a slow season. Freelance stuff is kind of hard to come by.

So, um, I'm just, I'm a little bit like frantic, like trying to figure out what to do. Uh, you know, I'm worried if I take a, a different full-time job, it'll get in the way of this like, exciting opportunity. Uh, and this is gonna sound like a tangent, but I promise it's going somewhere. Have you guys heard of O Cards?

Oh, mm-hmm. . It's this kind, it's like carro adjacent kind of thing where you, like, you draw a card that's like the, um, like Oracle cards maybe. I don't know what an Oracle card is. That's 

[00:40:01] Olivia: like, like a lot of the stuff we would do at our old job would be people mm-hmm. that had their own deck and it wasn't the traditional tarot cards.

Yeah. But like, it'll be 

[00:40:09] Zach: like, this is less like spiritual necessarily. Mm-hmm. . It's not necessarily spiritual and it's, it's like a psychological game or like, um, oh. Therapeutic kind of game. It's, it's more like a conversation starter. I want, I want some, because you draw a card that's like a context, it's just like an a box that says a word on the outside of it.

And then you draw another card that is the image that goes in the box. And so you ask a question out loud and then you draw those two cards and you just start talking about it. And the other day I was doing this with my girlfriend the other day when she was in town. 

[00:40:47] Victor: Uh, you blush every time you say girlfriend.

[00:40:50] Zach: My girlfriend love to say it's it's brand new relationship. So still smitten, . But, uh, I asked it, I, uh, my question was like, what should I do about my job situation? And the outside card said, uh, wait. And the inside card was a picture of a green. Ha, huh? 

[00:41:11] Victor: That plays right into a thought that I had while, while you were talking about your, your conflict.

Um, oh, please. Yeah. So, okay. So planes represent, um, trajectory, right, of, uh, project, right? So, uh, whether things are going and generally it's like, is the plane doing well? Is the plane failing? Is there a problem with the plane? Something like that. The sta the status of the plane is the status of the project or idea or whatever you're working on.

So you've got two planes clipping through each other, like disrupting each other and leaving you in a state where you got no idea what's happening with any of them, right? Mm-hmm. . And so you said you've got this anxiety of like, what if these project in projects interfere with each other? You have multiple exciting things going on and you don't know where any of them are going.

That could be representative of like feeling like you've got too many balls in the air or something. 

[00:42:08] Zach: Yeah, for sure. And then, yeah, so I I I, I feel like it's, it's an interesting or we even, we laughed out loud when we pulled these cards that it would be like a green light, but it's saying wait. Mm-hmm. . But it, it felt very much like the conversation that came out of that was about like, I mean, I mean, the old phrase, hurry up and wait, it does seem like, like something cool will happen.

I just have to be patient like this, this podcast. And the other one that I alluded to, you know, uh, are both very exciting things, but they're gonna require some, like, patience and, um, and so yeah, I'm hesitant to like, get another plane in the air and, um, and, and complicate things further out of like, um, inpatient, yeah.

Um, so it is funny, there was Olivia's voice going, it's, oh, it's cuz the UFOs want them . Um, 

[00:43:01] Victor: yeah. But like Olivia appearing in that moment, like she said, is kind of a clue that like, uh, she's involved with one of the planes in the air. Mm-hmm. , right? Mm-hmm. , you're, you have some deeper awareness that like one of the things that you feel like is a new project that you don't know where it's going and, um, maybe you're not sure how to spend your time or whatever.

Like Olivia's part of that. 

[00:43:26] Zach: Yeah. Or it could be like, I mean, it could be multiple things at once, but Yeah, it could be either like, as, you know, coem of the dream team, it was just, like I said, we had just recorded when I had that dream. Like, uh, like how you're her dream clippy. She might be my dream clipper , in this dream anyway.

[00:43:45] Olivia: Just, yeah. Or I'm coming in and like, making scary faces at you. 

[00:43:51] Victor: Oh yeah. So I'm, I'm gonna take a quick look at aliens and see if it leans into 

[00:43:55] Olivia: this interpretation. I've been having so many, I've been having alien dreams too. 

[00:43:59] Zach: Yeah. The fact that the, the u f O was super exciting to me too was like important I think.

Yeah. Yeah. Because I think the message of that, part of the dream that I also got from the O cards was, um, that, you know, if there are too many balls in the air, like eventually the ones that aren't supposed to be there will fall. And the thing that is gonna be the most exciting and successful will naturally take, uh, precedence.

It'll, it, it will take over. And 

[00:44:28] Olivia: so we're are, we got some competition for, for Zach's attention. . 

[00:44:34] Zach: That's really, no, it's all, it's all podcast stuff. I mean, I, when I say balls in the air, like I'm also doing music and Yeah. Writing screenplays. I, I do too much shit. It could, and it could just be about professional prospects too.


[00:44:46] Victor: podcast is gonna ride your coattails right to success. Oh, yeah. Okay. So aliens to dream of aliens represents aspects of your personality that are unfamiliar, unknown, or unusual. An alien male also represent a situation in your life that you can't do anything about. You may also be observing or experiencing things that are not normal for you.

Things that may be hard to explain or understand. Um, yeah, I think UFOs are probably more relevant here. You know, um, even though Olivia said aliens, right? The aliens want the planes. I mean, they're very 

[00:45:16] Olivia: similar entries. Yeah. Yeah. Well, let me see. What, what's the, the differences that UFOs are experiences, whereas aliens are aspects of your personalities.


[00:45:28] Zach: Yeah, that's what I wrote in my, uh, what I played in quotes was, uh, wondering why they're not moving. I hear Olivia's disembodied voice say, it's because the aliens want it. That's what I, that's what I wrote and I wrote it down like right after I had the dream. So 

[00:45:41] Olivia: the aspect of your personality that are unfamiliar, unfamiliar to you, unknown or unusual want, that's what wants it.

[00:45:52] Zach: Yeah. According to Pilot, what I saw was A U F O is like presumed that it's being piloted by aliens. But 

[00:46:00] Victor: yeah, I think these are new experiences you're having. Right. And um, yeah, I think, I think, uh, what it sounds like to me is you may be having some anxiety about there being so many exciting things happening and so much up in the air and so many prospects, and this is maybe something pushing you towards trying to enjoy the ride instead.

[00:46:22] Zach: Yeah. And trusting that. Did. Um, there won't always be this many balls in the air. Like eventually it will boil down to the, the, the, the most important things. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. For sure. 

[00:46:33] Olivia: I'm wondering like, uh, okay, so like the dream that I think we talked about last time, uh, that I had, that had those two very different like scenarios.

The one with like the, the tech, the techy airport thing with the robot owl, and then the one with the like, oh yeah. Old country road and the cult, uh, on the, uh, on the, like the train tracks. Um, like those felts to me, like a connected dream because there wasn't like a, a mark between them, right? They felt, it felt like one continuous experience, even though they felt very different and those ended up.

The same, meaning the same thing, right? Mm-hmm. . Um, so I'm wondering, cuz your dream, to me it feels like the first thing might be about something different, but um, yeah, I'm, I'm gonna assume, or I imagine that it's related in some way to this second part that we seem to have kind of Yeah, 

[00:47:33] Zach: like I said, it was, it was a long night of lots of dreams, but I wrote those down together cuz I felt like there was a through line story-wise, cuz when I was on the bike path encountering the aliens, I was still thinking about the comedy show.


[00:47:45] Olivia: Hmm. Okay. 

[00:47:47] Zach: And also this theory that we're coming up with now does make sense for the end part too, where I'm like laying in a hospital bed and, and finding out that I'm not actually taking pictures of UFOs, I'm taking pictures of a TV that's like showing an ancient aliens or whatever. I think that part would be like the fear part.

Mm-hmm. that, like 

[00:48:09] Olivia: that the experience wasn't 

[00:48:11] Zach: that none. That's exciting. Real. 

[00:48:13] Victor: Yeah. Mm. Right. That's the anxiety that, um, instead of, uh, everything unnecessary falls away and the good stuff remains. It's that everything falls away and you're left with nothing at the end of the 

[00:48:28] Zach: Yeah. I think a lot of dreams are like you having a conversation with yourself and you're like, you're just having a stream of consciousness and putting images to it in real time.

I think the alien part was the peak of like, um, feeling good about stuff. Like that's when I, that part of the dream, I was like in a state of confidence, like, yeah, everything will be fine. There's a lot of balls in the air, but like the most important ones will shine through. And uh, uh, and then, but then some other part of me came in and was like, but what if not though?

So like, what if it's all just fake? 

[00:49:02] Olivia: Right. Um, I'm just thinking like something you mentioned earlier that comedy to you is like a thing, it was a ball that you had in the air at one point, right? And you have not pursued it because you were like, you've decided that you're not good at that, or that that's not going to be a successful thing for you.

Right. So like, and comedy is something that comes up in your dreams a lot. And I just wonder if for you that that is like symbolic of, um, some kind of like dropped ball, right? A ball that didn't, didn't make it. And then the, the thing that I was gonna connect that to is that Tim Hyd Decker is somebody that is a comedian that you idolize, right?

Yeah. Or that he, yeah. Like he's your big Yeah. You're a big fan of him and like, 

[00:49:52] Zach: And that was very frustrating in the dream to be like, like I felt like I was best friends with this idol of mine, but he wasn't like getting anything I said . 

[00:49:59] Olivia: Yeah. He was misunderstanding you, right? Like, yeah. Yeah. I don't like that.

Does feel connected. Um, if you look at it as a, a thing that didn't work out right. 

[00:50:10] Victor: Mm-hmm. at the, at the end of the dream, did you feel trapped in the hospital bed or were you just in the hospital bed? 

[00:50:18] Zach: No, again, I think it, if it had the like, setup of a hospital, but it felt like home. Hmm. I wasn't like, thrilled to be there, but it's not cuz I was trapped.

It's cuz I was like, because I was boring. Gotcha. I wanted to be abducted 

[00:50:34] Victor: and you see, uh, so the comedy entry I think plays into what we were talking about, uh, a little bit. Uh, to dream of a comedy show represents an experience you're having where you're noticing how ridiculous other people are being or how unimportant certain beliefs or situations are.

Awareness of your own stupidity or that of others, which I think if, if you're looking at this as like, um, kind of trying to shift your own thoughts and feelings about something, you know, from anxiety to, you know, appreciation or joy or whatever, then it's like maybe an awareness of like a ridiculousness of your current mindset or something.

I dunno. Yeah. But also like we've talked about, um, you know, when something has specific meaning to you that kind of can override whatever the dream Bible has to say. Right. And comedy is personal to you, you know, so it's not quite the same thing. 

[00:51:30] Zach: Yeah. Cause in a lot of the dreams in my like recurring dreams where I'm performing it like that, that feels like it's based on memories of having done that and like, um, you know, sort of the highs of, of being successful at that.


[00:51:46] Olivia: When you're doing comedy, are you. In your dreams are, are you good at comedy usually? 

[00:51:52] Zach: Yeah. Yeah, that's what I was saying is the, the paradoxes that, that I can never do music right. In a dream, even though like I'm actually confident in my ability to do that. Whereas maybe you threw me on stage and, and we're like, dude, five minutes of comedy.

I would have a panic attack, but in a, in a dream. And it's always improv in a dream too. I'm not doing scripted material. I'm just riffing and I'm crushing it somehow. 

[00:52:16] Olivia: There's like, there's something, uh, here about like, um, being misunderstood or misperceived, right? Like, uh, cuz I feel like in music where you, you actually do feel confident about that in your dream.

You're, you can't do it. Right. And then, um, comedy, like you feel like you're, you're killing it, which is also kind of a, like a misrepresentation, I guess, of you in, in your mind. Um, yeah. And then there's like the, the, the comedian in your dream was like confused by you, like, and misunderstanding or like, thought what you were saying or doing was weird or like throwing him off.

And then Tim Hy Decker was misunderstanding you. I dunno, there's just something about like a, a skewed perception of you. That's true. 

[00:53:05] Victor: The, uh, the zoo entry is all about, um, being bothered by, you know, Stupid or, you know, off the behavior of other people is, or how a situation is really. Yeah. That's weird to dream of.

A zoo represents situations where you're noticing negative or primitive behavior in others, feeling comfortable that other people are stupider than you, a sense of isolation from crazy behavior. You may be near people who are less mature or intelligent than you are, which is kind of the experience you were having with Tim.

Hy Decker was like, he just wasn't getting it. He wasn't getting you, he was being kind of an asshole. Um, not wanting to get involved in sell or stupid matters could represent exploration or observation of something dangerous while keeping safe. And then down here, alternatively, a zoom may reflect disbelief at how childish, crazy, or arrogant a situation is.

Enjoying observing other people act primitive or unintelligent in situations where there is no possibility for it to, to embarrass you. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, it seems like it, it connects on in some way to your, to your conversation with Tim Hyd Decker. 

[00:54:13] Zach: Yeah. And then it makes sense that that could easily transition into the baseball arena, which felt the same, but with which just, it's also funny, the, the zoo felt emp empty.

Like I knew it was a zoo, but I didn't see any animals. 

[00:54:28] Olivia: Yeah. Cause the zoo itself was the stupid people. , 

[00:54:32] Victor: the dream of a baseball game represents a mental or emotional struggle to cancel, stop, or eliminate something 

[00:54:39] Zach: weird. That's so, yeah. It's one of those plain Bible things. It's like very specific for something that you would think would be very broad.

Like America's pastime . Right, right. A 

[00:54:48] Olivia: metaphor for conflict over an opportunity to get rid of a problem or unwanted situ. 

[00:54:55] Victor: Huh. Yeah. That's interesting cuz it does kind of that transition of zoo to baseball game mirrors, like your annoyance or disbelief at, uh, how poorly your interaction was going, and then the desire to rid yourself of the situation which you end up doing at the baseball game.


[00:55:15] Olivia: then you're thinking about that interaction as you're walking or ride. Were you riding a bike? Is that what you said? 

[00:55:23] Victor: There was a bike 

[00:55:23] Olivia: trail. That he's a bike. A path You were on a bike. Bike path. Okay. You're like, no, but I was, you're walking, but you're like remini, like ruminating on that right. When this airplane situation happens, right?

[00:55:36] Zach: Yeah. Yeah. I'm trying to connect this to real life stuff and it. The best I can do at the moment is that around the time I had this dream a couple weeks ago, I was feeling very, very burned out and, um, about, um, just being surrounded by people all the time. I just, I'm a pretty private guy. There's not a lot of he says on a, on a podcast about like, exploring your own psyche.

But, uh, but I, I mean, just like physically, like in my day-to-day life, I, I'm, I'm pretty private and there's just no reprieve in a city like Los Angeles. You're just always surrounded by people. 

[00:56:12] Olivia: Are you feeling like a conflict in yourself between like your desire to like, Do the work and have the opportunities in your job that are, that are available to you because you are in LA and like your actual, um, existence there and like, like do you like being in LA or do you not like it really and it just has like, 

[00:56:36] Zach: yeah.

No, I'm only kind of, only here. I actually was just talking about this a lot recently with friends and family actually between now and having the, this dream that like, cause I went back to Colorado for, um, for Christmas. Um, and I forgot like how much I kind of missed it. I was, I was really eager to leave.

And then I came back and I was like, oh, it's pretty fucking peaceful . Um, I was in a Sprouts and there was nobody in there. I hadn't been in an empty grocery store in a long time, and I was like, like dancing around to, to the sting song playing on the radio. And I was like, what is this weird sublime feeling?

And it's just, it was just peace . It's just the, the grocery store near my house. You can't, you can go in there at one 30 in the morning. It's still gonna be packed. Not packed, but like, not peaceful. Yeah. 

[00:57:33] Victor: So it's pretty intuitive, but the crowd's entry like perfectly matches what you're talking about. It, uh, represents a need for space privacy or solitude.

He may feel you can't think clearly or be honest about your real feelings forced to conform. Oh, 

[00:57:48] Zach: right. But that's, yeah. So that's what I've been talking to friends and family about is like, if it weren't for like trying to pursue career stuff, I would not choose to be in la, California. Maybe California's gorgeous.

Yeah, the whole west coast though. Like if I could live anywhere and do my dream job from anywhere, I probably would come back to Seattle. Come 

[00:58:05] Victor: on 

[00:58:05] Olivia: up. You, you probably, I feel like there are a lot of opportunities that, that could present themselves to you like that. Like something that you would be able to get, like the one that you're talking about, right.

That could turn into a full-time thing that something like that might not actually require you to be there, but it like required you to start there. 

[00:58:28] Zach: I think this one would require me to be there, but, 

[00:58:31] Olivia: but like other things, 

[00:58:32] Zach: right? Like, well, if I did it for a few years and, and moved on to something different.

Yeah. Like, yeah. The arena in which I seek to, to like, you know, have a career is podcasting, which can be done from anywhere now. Yeah. Yeah. Um, it's harder when you're the engineer. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. But producer work you can do kind of from anywhere. Definitely. Isn't that what you're doing? Is that what your new title is?

Yeah. Mm-hmm. . That's what I thought. 

[00:58:59] Victor: The through line I'm seeing. So yeah, I think that, um, if we try and connect these two halves of the dream, um, sounds like you've got day-to-day frustrations, um, with LA and you know, like you, you were talking about like, oh, you know, freelance work has been hard to find, like the day-to-day struggle of, um, doing what you're doing.

Um, and so you had a whole journey of your frustration with that and your need for solitude. And then your dream kind of a, allows you to get that you end up walking on the bike path and then that's like you exiting those frustrations and anxieties and then that brings you to a place where you kind of refocus onto the things you're excited about and, um, the, the reasons why you're doing what you're doing.


[00:59:48] Olivia: And it, and it kind of, it ends on again, like. An anxiety about that. Right? 

[00:59:54] Victor: Right. Of is this just an illusion, is the reason I'm here, just me fooling myself. 

[01:00:01] Zach: Yeah. Cuz that's kind of been the, the trajectory of these conversations that I've been having about my real life is, you know, starts with, I'm just so fucking sick of LA I just want, I, I'm such an impatient person when things don't go exactly the way I want it to, I'm, I'm, I have my finger on that like, abort button.

I'm gonna just like start over, pack up, move to a different city, try again. Mm-hmm. . But this is kind of like, well, you know, give it a few years , be, be patient. Um, and then, then, you know, we can think about making a career change if nothing happens. But like things are happening there it is. It's not gonna be overnight.


[01:00:40] Victor: But we'll say if you leave LA this podcast is over. Okay. We need you out there hustling for us. We need you making connections. We're not gonna do this on our own from Seattle. So, uh, counting on you, buddy. 

[01:00:52] Zach: All right. I'll try not to let you down.

[01:01:17] Victor: I had a couple of dreams recently that stuck with me and I, I had a realization maybe about, um, their interconnectedness. Um, and so I'm just gonna kinda. I, I've been doing dream interpretation homework, you know, and I'll present here. Um, yeah. But, so I shared a dream a while ago where I talked about, um, I was in a social situation with family, uh, and I said something and then it caused, uh, my grandmother to, you know, horribly be maimed and injured.

Right. Do you remember that, Zack? 

[01:01:56] Zach: Yeah. Yeah. I think I just edited that one. I think that was episode six. 

[01:01:59] Victor: Yeah. I think we were just listening to it and that, that refreshed my memory of this. So I've had a couple other dreams recently that I think are connected. Um, I had a dream where me and Olivia were going to go to what kind of felt like a summer camp maybe, or like, it had like a, like camp vibes.

Um, and I, we were. Sitting down and like, like at some guy's desk and I, I, there was like some kind of interview or whatever. I basically, we were supposed to go in and answer a couple questions that we had ahead of time and the, the conversation went very poorly and like I was the problem the whole time.

Um, there was some, like, there was some question about what we were gonna do there and I thought there was like a joke in there or something like funny or interesting that, uh, I ended up like presenting lyrics to a song I had written. It was like a real song that I've written and like, somehow it came into this dream is like how I was.

What I wanted to do or how I wanted to respond to this question. And he took the, and took like the lyrics or whatever, and he was like confused and offended and didn't know what to make of it. And then I tried to explain like, oh, it's like, it's like a joke. It's, it's funny because it connects to this.

And he like was having none of it. Uh, and it was just like a very uncomfortable interaction. And this guy made me feel like, uh, I was ruining his day and like making him feel, uh, uncomfortable. And um, and then, uh, another dream that I had was, uh, we, we have two dogs. We got Casper Friday, and, uh, Casper's like kind of a, a quiet, sad dog.

And Friday is like an excited, uh, rambunctious dog and mm-hmm. , uh, in my dream. She was being really loud and disruptive and I was trying to manage her. And, um, I was like trying to get her to quiet down, trying to get her to, to, you know, I was in this like, battle of wills with my dog and like, something, something happened and I think I like dropped something on.

I dropped like her crate on her or something, and. It, it felt very much like it felt with my grandmother, um, where like, I had dropped this thing on my dog and it like hit her really hard in the side and she was like, injured or, or like, you know, sad and upset and the mood had shifted horribly and like, uh, there was this terrible situation that I was responsible for.

Um, and yeah, I, I feel like all of these dreams tie together into this like real, like I, I have some social anxiety and I have some like concerns about, uh, how I navigate talking to people. And, um, all of these seem to like, tie together into this sense of like, not trusting myself to, you know, like be myself or be comfortable with people, you know?

I feel like I have to, I, I tend to keep walls up a lot. And, um, takes a lot for me to relax around people. And I, it just keeps, it feels like, it just keeps coming up in my dreams of like, I make, I make a misstep and it has like horrible repercussions like that. And it's just like reinforcement of an anxiety that I have that keeps coming up in my dreams.

[01:05:40] Zach: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, go ahead. 

[01:05:42] Olivia: Well, I, I was just gonna say that like, at, that's a, um, that scenario that is happening in your dreams is, is something that like, can, seems to come up in real life too. Like you'll come away from interactions, like concerned that you did make somebody uncomfortable and like constantly.

Yeah. Yeah. And, and like I'm often there for those interactions, right. And. Um, I, I feel like in this particular area and kind of this particular area alone, because I, I, I do feel like you, um, I don't feel like this applies broadly to you, but I feel like you don't see yourself very clearly in that particular situation and that you have like, um, a misperception of yourself that's, and you're like, it's really hard on yourself when you're like, you're having totally fine and normal conversations and you're very pleasant to be around and people like you.

[01:06:41] Zach: That's what anxiety 

[01:06:43] Olivia: does for you, right? Yeah, for sure. 

[01:06:45] Victor: It's definitely like a therapy thing. Cause it just, it, it is a constant, like I will find a way to convince myself that. Um, I upset someone or like bothered someone or was being annoying or being irritating or, you know, it just like stresses me out all the time.

I, I constantly feel like I have fumbled, uh, like a social interaction and kind of bums me out. I don't know. Um, 

[01:07:12] Zach: yeah, that is an interesting, um, contrast, I guess is the word to the dream of mine that we just did. Mm-hmm. , because it is also about like social or there, there was an element to mine about like social interactions gone awry.


[01:07:27] Olivia: mm-hmm. . Yeah. And like, being misunderstood, right? 

[01:07:31] Victor: Or, or 

[01:07:31] Zach: like Yeah. It's, it's interesting interactions being skewed how similar Victor and I are. Like, we're both introverts. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but then, but the emotional response is just ever so slightly different. Like in your dreams it results in like someone being injured or burned alive.

It's like these grave consequences that cause you to feel deep. Shame. Yeah. Guilt. Um, yeah. And on my end it's like anger and resentment for having be being put in the situation in the first place. Mm-hmm. , 

[01:08:04] Victor: I feel like that's healthier. I feel like that's better. I don't know. I would trade my thing for your 

[01:08:08] Zach: thing.

I think they both take years off your life. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if I wanna walk around with this like, ball of resentment up in my chest cavity. 

[01:08:18] Victor: I do feel like I'm walking around with a couple of things where it's like that, that is a therapy thing, but I don't, I don't really have any drive or interest in going to therapy, but like I can see, I just don't have the money.

Yeah. It's like, uh, well I'm sure that would help with that, but I'm gonna keep limping or limping along. , emotionally broken. Uh, yeah. 

[01:08:42] Olivia: Something that, um, I've heard a few times that has really stuck with me is that like, You should go do your therapy work prior to having children. And because like if anything is gonna trigger the fuck out of you, it's your own kids

And like that makes anything sense that you're carrying around with you. Like, um, your kids are gonna really bring that out for you. And so like, yeah, I don't know that, that's just something that has stuck with me recently. , like is called generational trauma. I'll probably put it off until then, but , 

[01:09:21] Zach: yeah, that's the, the circle of life.

Yeah. Your kids trigger the things in you and then you react and you give it to them. Right. 

[01:09:31] Victor: We talked, we talked about a dream of mine a while ago, and it was, uh, like redneck Willy Wonka or whatever. That has really stuck with me like, because that is a thing. That keeps coming up for me. And, um, yeah, for anyone that doesn't, that didn't hear that episode, um, yeah, we, we, I had a dream where the conclusion was kind of that I, um, I, I feel like I, uh, work on projects or, uh, put my time and energy into things, but they never like quite rise to being like, um, legitimate, you know?

Uh, and that, yeah, that's just like a constant, I was thinking about that today. I was just like, you know, I, I, I work on music and all sorts of projects that, um, mean a lot to me and I, I feel like I'd rather be doing something than be doing nothing, but I just can't ever seem to like crack into. Something that feels like real, like, I've really done something, you know, that it always feels like I'm just like entertaining myself instead of actually doing something of value.

You know? What mean, 

[01:10:40] Olivia: what does that mean? But, but like, what would it mean for it to be of value? Like, what would that look like to you? 

[01:10:49] Victor: It's like, it's like a feeling. It's like I, I, I feel like there's a feeling I should be getting that I'm not getting, you know? And Yeah. I dunno. 

[01:11:00] Olivia: Yeah. Isn't that just life though?

Like, you're, you're not, not ever gonna be satisfied, right? , 

[01:11:06] Zach: but I feel like I know exactly what you're talking about, but the, the, what, what I pined on is, has to do with like recognition, I guess. Yeah. 

[01:11:16] Victor: I think that's a big component of it for me. You 

[01:11:18] Zach: know, uh, like I don't, I never aspired to be like famous for anything, but like, I always just wanted like a group of peers, like a group of people that.

Know what they're talking about to like, appreciate what I do. Yeah. You 

[01:11:34] Victor: know what I mean? 

[01:11:35] Zach: Totally. Yeah. It doesn't need to be everybody, but if like a community, I guess is the word. If a community of people like heard what I have written or, or, or, or this podcast or like, anything that I do, and Yeah. And it's like a community of people that like are into that thing.

I get 

[01:11:54] Olivia: that. I definitely get that. Uh, it, it's like it means a lot when people, um, pay attention to something you make because they like it and they want to engage with it. Be for themself, not for you, not for any other reason. Just because they get something out of it. And like that. Um, Victor, that's something that has been really meaningful to you with music right?

Is like, there've been a few people that have popped up here and there who've like, Really like, deeply connected with your music and like brought, like, contacted you and talked to you about it. Right. And like, I, I imagine that that is the kind of thing that is, that feels like that makes your, what you've made feel real, 

[01:12:41] Victor: right?

Yes, absolutely. You know, I've, I feel like I've managed to eek out like a little bit of that like life satisfaction validation outta music in that, um, you know, people that I know that I respect that are talented musicians, like have a genuine appreciation for stuff that I've done. And, um, and there's been a, like a couple people, there's been a handful of people that have kind of popped up out of the woodwork over the years that have, uh, been like, Hey, I listened to that album you recorded, uh, almost a decade ago.

And, uh, it was great and I really liked it. And that's like, Really, really meaningful to me in a way that's hard to, hard to express, you know? Um, but I still feel like, you know, um, I'm, I'm still chasing that, I guess on some level, on like a, like a grander scale. You know? I, um, I still feel like I haven't, uh, become a version of myself that I am satisfied with.

You know, I still feel like I'm searching for something. And for me that looks like, oh, I'm gonna work on this. Oh, I have this idea. I'm gonna try that. Oh, I'm gonna work on this project. And so, um, yeah, not, not feeling like I've gotten anywhere with stuff eats at me, but 

[01:13:59] Olivia: Victor, I feel like if you got to a place where you like, felt like, oh yeah, I'm satisfied.

I don't know, like, what does that even look like? Would you like, what, what then, right. Like, I think I would go crazy. 

[01:14:15] Victor: Yeah. And I'm not talking about like, like, I'm not talking about like true blissful happiness, you know? Yeah, exactly. Like where you just like, you achieve something where it's like, oh, I get to just like walk around in bliss for the rest of existence or whatever.

But like, I do feel like I have not cracked, um, legitimacy in a lot of places. You know? It's like I, I constantly feel like I am like on the outside or like on the outskirts of something. I have not reached a place with anything where I feel like I have, um, like, um, Really accomplished something where, um, where it feels real.

I don't know. Yeah, I don't, that's just how I feel about it. Yeah. 

[01:15:07] Olivia: No, I, I get that. Yeah. I gue I guess, uh, what I meant by that was just that like, I see you, you as, um, a project person who like, you're like a tanker, you know, like that's, um, so like, I guess maybe what you're, so there's 

[01:15:23] Zach: always gonna be another project, is that what you mean?

[01:15:25] Olivia: Yeah, yeah. Like, at least, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but 

[01:15:30] Victor: No, there's, there's always gonna be 

[01:15:30] Olivia: another project, I guess like May, is it maybe more about getting to a place where like you can do your tinkering for you and not for the success of the project? 

[01:15:43] Victor: Yeah, man, I don't know. Yeah. This is like, this is kind of a, kind of a, this is, this is maybe the thing that I'm most in my head about.

So it's weird to talk about it. Um, uh, but. Yeah, it's, I I would never stop doing things, but yeah, I, I feel like, you know, I have, I have this idea of like, um, ideally one day I will be an old man and I will want, and I will be, um, past the point of doing anything other than tinkering for tinkerings sake. And I want to be able to look back and be like, oh, I did that and I did that, and I'm proud of that.

And I don't feel like I'm there yet. I feel like if, uh, if, um, yeah, I don't know, feel like, uh, I have a lot more that I'd like to accomplish. Yeah, well, don't go die 

[01:16:39] Olivia: yet. We'll 

[01:16:39] Victor: see. 

[01:16:40] Olivia: I dunno. See, I think you've got some time. 

[01:16:44] Zach: Thank you for listening to The Jung and the Restless. You can follow us on social media at The Jung and the Restless Pod and submit your dreams for interpretation to The Jung and the Restless

Pod at Gmail, 

[01:16:56] Victor: and as we always say, beetle, Beetlejuice beet Beetlejuice tiger

[01:17:10] Zach: clock.

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